House January 6 Committee: Public Hearings – Day 4
This post and comment thread are dedicated to the House January 6 Committee hearings scheduled to begin Tuesday June 21, 2022 at 1:00 p.m. ET.
Please take all comments unrelated to the hearings to a different thread.
The hearings will stream on:
House J6 Committee’s website: https://january6th.house.gov/news/watch-live
House J6 Committee’s YouTube page: TBD
C-SPAN’s House J6 hearing page: https://www.c-span.org/video/?521075-1/fourth-hearing-investigation-capitol-attack
C-SPAN’s YouTube page: https://youtu.be/7KakS8YmwTc
Check PBS for your local affiliate’s stream: https://www.pbs.org/ (see upper right corner)
Twitter is carrying multiple live streams (NBC, PBS, Washington Post, Reuters, CSPAN, Bloomberg): https://twitter.com/i/events/1539226449718038529
ABC, NBC, CBS will carry the hearings live on broadcast; CNN and MSNBC will carry on their cable networks.
Twitter accounts live tweeting the hearing:
Marcy’s Twitter thread: https://twitter.com/emptywheel/status/1539293768993603619
Brandi Buchman-DailyKos: https://twitter.com/Brandi_Buchman/status/1538831520592539649 (Buchman’s thread breaks, check her main feed as necessary)
Scott MacFarlane-CBS: https://twitter.com/MacFarlaneNews/status/1539292006903693312
Laura Rozen: https://twitter.com/lrozen/status/1539293133309190144 (Rozen’s thread breaks several times, check her main feed as necessary)
If you know of any other credible source tweeting the coverage, please share a link in comments.
The witnesses anticipated for today’s hearing are:
Brad Raffensperger, GA secretary of state
Gabe Sterling, GA election official
Rusty Bowers, Arizona House Speaker
Wandrea ArShaye “Shaye” Moss, former Georgia election worker
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Any updates will appear at the bottom of this post; please bear with any content burps as this page may be edited as the day progresses.
Again, this post is dedicated to the House January 6 Committee and topics addressed in testimony and evidence produced during the hearing.
All other discussion should be in threads under the appropriate post with open discussion under the most recent Trash Talk.
To new readers and commenters: welcome to emptywheel. New commenters, please use a unique name to differentiate yourself; use the same username each time you comment.
If you are leaving a comment, please be concise; 100 words is the optimum length.
If you are sharing active links your comment may be delayed by auto-moderation.
If contributors and moderators seem slow, it’s because they’re dealing with higher than usual volume of comments including trolling.
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Something’s going on with Twitter. It looks like they’ve been gamed. There’s no event showing up on my mobile app and instead the POS right-wing crap outlet Newsmax is at the top of Trends.
I have it on my desktop but not my on mobile device which is why I could grab the link.
Anybody else have this same experience? Let me know in comments, thanks.
One more reminder: This thread is dedicated to the hearing *only*. Anything else can go into the Open Thread or to its respective post.
THANKS for continuing to do such an outstanding job on these posts, Rayne!
[typo: there’s an extraneous b in the link to Marcy’s thread]
[thanks, I fat fingered my keyboard while editing, should be updated now. /~Rayne]
1:03 THOMPSON: In order
1:21 NM claims in recent election GRIFFIN
1:08 THOMPSON: We won’t have close calls. We’ll have a catastrophe.
Two points of focus:
1] Keep in mind that TRUMP already knew the stolene election allegations were nonesense. [BARR-“no merit” [“no evidence of subterfuge”]
2] Number of threats against official >>> violence
[STERLING: “It has all gone too far”.]
1:14 SCHIFF opening statement: Phony certificates, fake electors
For those who might not have seen it, Gabriel Sterling was livid in his denunciation of Trump & Co.’s attempt to browbeat and intimidate GA’s SOS and election workers.
Sterling and Bowers lived up to their oaths of office. While I vehemently disagree with their politics, I have only respect for their integrity.
THANKS to Aaron RUPAR and his VIDEO THREADS!
1:12 PM · Jun 21, 2022
1:15 PM · Jun 21, 2022
1:18 PM · Jun 21, 2022
1:21 PM · Jun 21, 2022
1:24 PM · Jun 21, 2022
1:19 TRUMP’s supporters heard these false allegations as a call to action [VIDEO]
1:20 [VIDEO Congressional investigator] CLETA!
1:22 11/21 8:18 PM TRUMP tweet
EASTMAN, GIULIANI, ELLIS, BANNON, ALEXANDER
I am shocked, SHOCKED, I tell you, to see those people associated with this effort.
harpie, I want to underscore what you just referenced: Stop The Steal began as Roger Stone’s plan to make the 2016 (!!!) election a contested battlefield, one on which the Clinton victory that all expected would be harassed endlessly into the courts and mainly in the media.
I don’t believe Trump would have conceded in 2016 had his gambit failed. His electoral college victory just delayed what now seems like the inevitable election war. We must remember how all this benefits the GOP writ large, even the ramrod institutionalists whom the J6 hearings have posited as heroes, as it predicates their “election security” mandates across the country.
and in Florida outside the vote counting office in 2000, right?
and in Florida outside the vote counting office in 2000, right?
Yes, there’s a long predicate there. I was just isolating Stop The Steal (TM) as a named project with deliberate goals.
1:30 PM · Jun 21, 2022
For the 11/5/20 MITCHELL / EASTMAN email, see:
Doesn’t the January 6th Committee have any witnesses who aren’t such crazed, rabid, wild-eyed, left-wing extremists?
So repulsive hearing Trumpers misusing treason and demanding death as a punishment. This is why the term should not be misused here.
1:27 This violence was a precursor of J6.
1:27 This violence is a precursor of J6.
1:29 SCHIFF: They did their jobs as we must do ours.
1:29 THOMPSON introduces witnesses
1:31 THOMPSON > BOWERS [speaker AZ House]
1:32 SCHIFF Re: NEW TRUMP statement
[TRUMP: “He told me the election was rigged and I won Arizona.”] BOWERS: FALSE
1:31 PM · Jun 21, 2022
1:35 PM · Jun 21, 2022
Never thought I would say “good on Rusty Bowers”. He is a wing nut asshole, but so far so good today.
I think he’s going to get through to a decent percentage of some of the aging angry boomers who back Trump. By decent, it may only be a few percent, but every bit helps.
I doubt that in the long run these “hearings” will get through to any noticeable amount of people.
It appears today’s hearing got through to Sen. Ron Johnson’s office which is now in damage control and denial mode on the office having anything to do with pushing the phony slates of electors.
Now, I am curious to see if Liz Cheney’s pointed shout out to Pat Cipollone will spur him to appear before the committee.
Remember what happened with Nixon? It was drip, drip, drip, drip, then BOOOOOOOOOOM! – the dam burst, and public hearings was part of what made the dam burst.
Totally agree with your Bowers assessment, but he is also sensing which way the wind is blowing and I see this as a major CYA move on his part. A helpful rat leaving the Titanic.
ETA: sorry for the off topic nature of this post!
I love your Nym for this site. I first went to college long ago in 1968, and the grave of Molly Pitcher was just a few blocks away from the campus in Carlisle PA. Many students visited her grave, it was a revered site for the student body.
The first female military hero of our nation!!!
Captain Molly was the first woman in the US to receive a military pension, as well.
1:35 BOWERS: GIULIANI never sent the evidence he claimed to have.
GIULIANI: “We have heard that there is a legal theory in AZ that you can remove the electors of President BIDEN and replace them.”
B: You are asking me to do something against my oath.
GIULIANI: “Aren’t we all Republicans here?”
1:38 PM · Jun 21, 2022
1:42 PM · Jun 21, 2022
Bowers’ statement about his faith and believing the Constitution was divinely inspired — whew. That one left a mark.
I heard that and had definitely mixed feelings. On the one hand, I appreciated how seriously he takes the constitution; on the other hand, does that mean that every time we amend the constitution, we are correcting God (or is it just that we weren’t listening to God well enough to get it right in the first place)?
Lol, there will not be any more Constitutional amendments in our lifetime.
Divinely inspired, but written by men. (FWIW, I’m an atheist).
As a pastor and scholar of history, trust me when I say that when someone like this says “divinely inspired,” they mean “God handed down each and every specific word of it to some religious stenographers” and definitely not “God gave the authors some good ideas to riff off of in their own words.”
I thought the Constitution being divinely inspired was a tenet of Mormonism.
He is a member of the Church of Latter Day Saints, I found out today.
1:45 BOWERS: GIULIANI: “We’ve got lots of theories but no evidence.”
No one provided me EVER with such evidence.
Jacob CHANSLEY invading AZ House of Reps building. PB’s outside.
1:48 [1/4/21?] EASTMAN asks them to vote to decertify the electors because we had plenary power to do so.
EASTMAN to BOWERS:”Just do it and let the Courts sort it out.” [paraphrase]
1:47 PM · Jun 21, 2022
1:50 PM · Jun 21, 2022
1:53 PM · Jun 21, 2022
1:51 BOWERS Call from Andy BIGGS 1/6 AM
1:53 BOWERS: We have no legal pathway for us to execute such a request.
1:55 BOWERS included Reagan’s words in his written statement.
> Peaceful transfer of power every four years is a miracle.
Invoking St. Reagan is big. I hope it gets through the thick skulls of at least some of the Trump supporters
It will not because past invocations haven’t. Weeks after the 2016 election, the GOP congressional caucus met in a closed door session with their so-called economics guru Stephen Moore who told them the GOP was no longer the party of Reagan and they’ve taken it to heart since then.
St Bonzo, if you please!
I cringe when I hear Washington National defamed.
1:55 PM · Jun 21, 2022
1:57 SCHIFF: Take a close look at the fake electors scheme
TRUMP team and supporters integrally involved.
1:58 IVESTIGATOR: 11/18/ CHESEBRO memo
Cassidy Hutchinson / Ronna Romney McDaniel /Justin Clark
RRMcD, Air quotes around we were “just helping”.
2:02 PM · Jun 21, 2022
2:05 PM · Jun 21, 2022
2:03 MI GOP electors planned to hide in Capitol MI overnight.
I can’t with this. It can’t be legitimate if you have to hide in a government facility to execute it. ~smh~
2:08 PM · Jun 21, 2022
2:10 PM · Jun 21, 2022
WI and MI!
Interesting to see the deeply religious, right-wing Trump supporters like Bowers run headlong into conflict between their faith and their political expediency. I’m not a fan of Bowers or Pence or many of their kind, but I’m grateful they chose faith over politics.
What I have difficulty understanding is how any truly religious person could vote for Trump even once, let alone twice.
I reckon they let their anti-abortion fervor blind them to the deal with the devil they were making.
It would probably be something along the lines that god chooses his vessels in ways which we can’t necessarily understand. So if the deity wanted, for example, abortion to be made illegal, then even though he chose a criminal and a con-man and a serial adulterer and sexual assaulter as his vessel, it’s not up to the faithful to question why he chose that vessel. (In Judges, the righteous judges of Israel get less and less noble as the book goes on, reaches a pretty low point with Samson (braggart, bully, etc.) and pretty much hits bottom with Ehud’s story.)
That might be understandable as an explanation, save for the fact that the folks who used that logic to give Trump a pass for grabbing women by the p*ssy were the same ones were first in line to condemn Bill Clinton for his sins. “How could we Good Christian People(tm) possibly tolerate a man as manifestly sinful as Clinton as our president?”
To me, it reads more like a way to explain away problems with your candidate and justify what you want to have.
There is no rhyme or reason to their “logic”. My cousin is deeply religious and when pressed on Trump’s failings, has absolutely replied that God chooses broken vessels to get His work done. And he was absolutely appalled with Bill Clinton’s failings. My cousin sees no double standard with that.
Motes in eyes, and all that.
The deeply religious have accepted Trump precisely because he’s an angry White man who put three conservative justices on the Supreme Court. The fact that he was able to put three on the court is proof to them of God’s workings.
Peterr, given the elapse of ~20 years, can you really say these are the same people?
Yes…and their INDOCTRINATED offspring.
Some offspring perhaps, but other offspring will reject the unsavory parts of their upbringing.
It’s actually very consistent. Clinton wasn’t promising to appoint anti-Roe Supreme Court Justices. Trump was. To the foaming anti-abortion right the ends justified the means.
I am struck by how seemingly ingrained what I can only term “mafia thinking” is to Trump’s view of the world – Republicans apparently were not party members to him but part of the “family” of which he was head.
Yes. He was basically President Paulie Walnuts.
HA!! I just spit iced tea all over my screen
Minus the nuts. Or the brains.
“Minus the nuts” Like Governor Ron DeSanstestes?
LOL. In reality, I think DeSantis has more raw courage than Trump, who is an abject coward both physical and moral. That’s not saying much about DeSantis, but he’s at least implicitly taking Trump on in his (now) home state.
2:10 BOWERS describes current threats to him/family
2:11 five minute recess
2:12 PM · Jun 21, 2022
2:16 PM · Jun 21, 2022
2:21 PM · Jun 21, 2022
What a fucking sad commentary of our nation.
It’s heart wrenching
2:26 THOMPSON: TRUMP had particular obsession with Georgia
2:31 STIRLING to TRUMP [VIDEO]
STIRLING to TRUMP: You likely lost the vote in GA.
2:33 STIRLING re: threats to election workers
2:33 STIRLING re: threats to election workers
2:33 PM · Jun 21, 2022
2:37 PM · Jun 21, 2022
RUDY: I am here on behalf of the president, Donald Trump.
Trump later today: Rudy? Hardly know him. Coffee boy….
I can’t wait to hear Sen. Johnson comment on wanting to deliver the fake electors’ fake votes to Pence.
He may take a leaf from McConnell’s book: “I haven’t heard anything about that report.”
don’t worry Rudy, you’re *not* a genius.
I saw a quote a few days ago that went something like this: “You can’t change someones position with reason if they didn’t use reason to get there.”
“You can’t reason someone out of something they weren’t reasoned into”
That’s it! Do you know who said it?
2:44 PM · Jun 21, 2022
2:47 PM · Jun 21, 2022
Who knew that state election officials were authorized to officially communicate their vote tallies regarding a presidential election to the federal government through a staff member to a U.S. Senator?
2:40 [VIDEO] STIRLING: 12/7/20 Disinfo Monday news conference
2:43 re: Competing with TRUMP’s disinfo
2:43: PAK, BARR, DONOGHUE – re: suitcasesaga TRUMP did not listen.
2:46 TRUMP- RAFFENSPERGER 1/2/21 call
2:47 TRUMP to [Chief investigator] Francis WATSON: You’ll be praised when the right answer comes out…everyone knows it’s wrong…whatever you can do …you know we have this date of the 6th which is a very important date.
…and “signed MAGA hats.” Sighhhhhh…
So basicly, “If you’ll commit fraud for us, we’ll give you $34 worth of MagaSwag.”?
2:51 PM · Jun 21, 2022
2:54 PM · Jun 21, 2022
2:56 PM · Jun 21, 2022
2:50 1/2/21 TRUMP-RAFFENSPERGER CALL [AUDIO]
2:54 next clip “Somebody dropped a lot of votes at night, Brad”
2:54: next clip: Trump claims about dead voters
2:55 Raffensperger: That 1-2-3-4 dead people
2:56 TRUMP – just say you recalculated
Would have been nice to have a follow-up question: who were their ballots cast for? Because I’m about willing to bet at least 2 were for TFG.
The follow-up I wanted was how many of them died between casting their ballots and Election Day.
That was Raffensberger’s most notable line. I hope it hurt.
Re: “30K Republicans skipped the Presidential race, voted down-ballot (the same thing that happened to Hillary in MI in 2016)”
One could reasonably wonder if TFG knew that, before Raffensberger said it today.
Detail oriented, Trump was not. I’d still love to find out who told him that he had an Article 2 that meant he had the power to do whatever he wanted.
2:59 PM · Jun 21, 2022
3:01 PM · Jun 21, 2022
2:57 TRUMP: I have a much a better link.
2:58 There’s only two answers, dishonesty or incompetence
2:59 TRUMP tweet suggesting criminal liability
“That’s a big risk to you and your lawyer”
3:00 TRUMP: So, look all I wanna do is this. I just wanna find 11,780 votes…[one more than we need]
3:01 TRUMP threat [“very dangerous stuff”]
3:03 PM · Jun 21, 2022
3:07 PM · Jun 21, 2022
Is asking for one more vote than needed to win evidence of a criminal intent?
T: “When you say there was no criminality, I think it’s very dangerous to say that.”
Classic indirect threat. I hear the old Mafia guys and the Hollywood actors who played them partied together and studied each other to refine their acts. And I guess lots of mean kids have studied the film versions ever since…
George Raft: “Raft was a childhood friend of Bugsy Siegel. Early in his career, Raft came under the influence of New York bootlegger, bookie, and racketeer, Owney Madden. Under the patronage of Madden, in the late 1920’s, he moved to Los Angeles to pursue a film career.”
Owney Madden was one of the owners of the Cotton Club.
Just want to say that hearing the presentation of the tape of the call and Raffensberger’s testimony, I’m confident there’s a violation of the federal statutes against using the power of office to interfere with elections. Raffensberger felt Trump was specifically threatening him. Courageous man for following the law.
Are you aware of any DOJ investigation of this looking at said charges, because I certainly am not. And they have known about the call since the tape first appeared. Federal charges on this are still unlikely, and would just bugger up any central charges Trump could be charged with. Until anyone definitively learned otherwise, this is a GA state law case.
Actually the. DA in Fulton County has a grand jury seated looking at state charges for Donald.
Actually, I have known that since Fani Willis said so. The question here is federal charges.
Are you aware of the existence of ANY Federal investigations into Trump, bmaz? If you are, that makes you way more knowledgeable than seemingly anyone outside the DOJ. All I said is I’m convinced there’s a violation of a Federal statute.
I’m confused. Isn’t your position that the DoJ doesn’t leak and holds its cards very close to its vest? Therefore, at this juncture it would appear we would not be aware of such investigation and charges.
Bmaz, are you still convinced that the Georgia election interference is just a state-level issue? One of the architects of Trump’s Georgia plan just got his house searched by the FBI. He wasn’t on the call but seems to me if the fake elector effort is drawing DOJ attention a direct demand by POTUS that a local election official change the numbers would, too.
I still think DOJ will leave that for GA.
The fact that details related to the intimidation of Moss and Freeman which overlapped the federal investigation weren’t included in the last House J6 Committee hearing suggests there’s awareness in DC in both House and DOJ that the Fulton County case needs to be allowed to run its course independently and without conflict caused by House and DOJ.
I’m not sure what details you’re referring to, Rayne. Can you point me to whatever that is? Thanks.
The shakedown by Kanye West’s former publicist. You can find it on your own.
Tnx. Found it. Only the best people!
3:03 And Brad, we just want to find the truth…so what are we gonna do here folks?
3:04 TRUMP at ELLIPSE
3:05 SCHIFF thanks witnesses and yields back.
THOMPSON thanks and dismisses witnesses.
3:10 PM · Jun 21, 2022
3:12 PM · Jun 21, 2022
3:07 THOMPSON welcomes final witness // Election worker in GA
This was when I started crying, and did not stop until she was excused.
I have a medical condition that makes it almost impossible to cry. This is the first time since my mother died, four and a half years ago.
I’m right there with you, Ginevra. That was deeply disturbing. I think the impact will sink in even more over the next few days.
I thought writing about it here would give me distance, but when I watched her testimony again last night it hurt even more. These women could be my family–which is very much *not* my reason for crying, except in a primordial, can’t-help-it way.
It’s just that there is so much more pain and hard work and constant effort in the face of unimaginable (to most) duress behind their testimony, and that came crashing through the TV screen both times. I have actually been surprised and moved to witness how much audiences generally seem to have responded. I was so afraid their pain would remain inscrutable to people who haven’t walked in shoes like theirs. (I have those shoes in my closet, and the shiny nice ones pinch your toes but you keep walking with your head up as if they didn’t.)
I am replying only after two days because it hit me so hard. All these ladies wanted to do was live in America, have a nice job or create a small business, build a family, and serve their community. They were totally in favor of everyingthing American in thought and deed. And they were trashed for it, a racist mob was sicced on them for it, people who can get on TV with zero effort lied about them and blew racist dog whistles for it. I am slowly moving from tears for them (and us!) to burning anger.
3:12 TRUMP, GIULIANI, OTHERS blamed her and her mother [false suitcasesaga]
3:13 Horrendous 12/10 GIULIANI [COMPETELY FALSE] allegations
3:18 NOT a USB – – a ginger mint!
ew: Here’s Rudy lying and race-baiting. [PHOTO]
3:18 PM · Jun 21, 2022
3:19 MOSS: “I felt like it was my fault for putting my family in this position.”
3:22 This has affected her life, [and her mother’s] PROFOUNDLY
3:22 PM · Jun 21, 2022
So goddamned fucking unfair that Donald Trump could cause so much personal trauma to an election worker and her entire family because he felt entitled to the White House. Shaye Moss deserves so much better in life for having put up with this crap.
Amen to that.
And yeah, election workers were already at risk because of COVID but they were supposed to put up with harassment and abuse by a mob on top of it?
It’s not just Trump and his minions, though, who are to blame. The entire GOP nurtured these attacks on our elections and they’ve refused to deal with it afterward.
OH YES! The fvcking ENTIRE GOP.
Longtime reader, and profoundly appreciate you, Rayne, Harpie, Dr. Marcy and all of the wise regulars here. But felt compelled to simply say this testimony at the end today is so heartbreaking as well as enraging. Shay, her mother and grandmother need to feel as much love and support (on every level) as possible. It was so powerful to hear from this young woman and her mother. Thank you Rayne again for always bringing the deep heart and crosscultural voice to these pages. Namaste.
[Hope I used the same name as before…?]
Digby captures the sentiment:
As someone who has been vilified by the lies of local Twitter trolls and their hangers-on, though not to anything like the extent these women and so many others were, this really got to me. The naked cruelty is unbearable. I do hope that any settlement includes very public apologies for lying about these innocent people. Something on the order of running ads during Tucker Carlson, Sean Hannity and Fox and Friends for at least ten shows each and buying a billboard in a prominent location in the Atlanta area for at least a month. Plus money, of course.
3:24 Mother had to leave her home beCAUSE J6 was coming. Was away for two months.
3:25 Grandmother was targeted…people at her home trying to get in to make a citizen’s arrest.
3:28 SCHIFF: These lies and threats discourage future election workers > THREAT TO DEMOCRACY
3:28 SCHIFF: These lies and threats discourage future election workers
3:30 SCHIFF thanks witnesses and yields back.
3:30 THOMPSON: Thanks witnesses.
3:25 PM · Jun 21, 2022
“My name is Ruby Freeman. […] I won’t even introduce myself by my name anymore.”
3:28 PM · Jun 21, 2022
3:30 PM · Jun 21, 2022
3:33 PM · Jun 21, 2022
3:35 PM · Jun 21, 2022
Kathy Griffin responded yesterday that yes, she understood how it felt to be targeted by POTUS, but I was really put off by that. Griffin wasn’t harassed for having worked to ensure other Americans could vote; as an artist she had to be familiar with negative feedback from the public though harassment goes beyond that. Moss and Freeman were conducting the business of our country’s democracy; they had no reason at all to anticipate targeting by anyone for their efforts on behalf of their community, state, and nation.
None of us are safe in Trumplandia, but some of us are far more vulnerable.
Rayne, I haven’t seen Griffin’s words yet, so I may be off base here. But I see what happened to her and what happened to Shaye and Ruby Moss as a both/and category: the world’s most vicious and empowered bully has always gone after those whom he senses others will also attack with him. Whether that was Rosie O’Donnell in the debate or Kathy Griffin, he was testing the extent of his power. Once he sensed it was virtually limitless–that enough of his followers would abandon all considerations of moral propriety in their zeal to do his bidding–he just cut loose. The Moss women might have represented a taboo category earlier (how racist could he afford to seem?) but no longer in 2020, when they became the acme of his targets by being Black women infinitely vulnerable to his power.
He’s like an experiment seeing what happens when you give a bully of the fundamentally cowardly and fearful type limitless power. Does he seek out equals to challenge? No, he does the opposite. So Kathy Griffin does know, up to a limit she probably would acknowledge.
I think women including Griffin know, have known, since before grab ’em by the pussy that Trump would inflict violence on certain groups in a way he wouldn’t inflict on others. It’s the reason millions of women were willing to take the the street and march in January 2017. Straight white men have always had less to fear from Trump than other segments of the population, until they got in the way of his ultimate criming. He’d probably have cut Pence a mess of slack had Pence countered with a demand of his own.
But Griffin didn’t lose her name/identity, career, home, won’t have to look over her shoulder the way Moss and Freeman have and will for some time. Once Benson leaves office — hopefully in 2026 or later — she will not live with the same fear which will linger over Moss and Freeman. It won’t be Trump but the monstrous racism he unleashed which will continue because he gave it permission, the evil genie he let out of the bottle.
ADDER — this is the evil genie at work, which at the time didn’t have the imprimatur of white male racist president and “America’s Mayor” behind it:
Rayne, you know I’m with you about the uncorked racism. I was simply talking about why Kathy Griffin might comment about having the hatred focused on her by name.
My child just now:
Lady Ruby t-shirt fundraiser for the 4th of July to aid election workers threatened.
Goddamn it. Just so angry-making. I hope they do crowdfunding online instead if they can’t do a fundraiser offline.
T-shirt should just say, “Lady Ruby.”
I like: “I Stand with Lady Ruby”
Good buy for Ruby (Tuesday)
Ain’t life unkind?
Last time I heard Rudy Tuesday was at the Four Seasons Landscape and Gardening yard.
yeah, I hear he sold out
Only smaller venues than Four Seasons Landscaping for him here on out.
3:31 SCHIFF closing statement
3:32 Whether TRUMP’s actions were criminal, is not ours to decide. But, his actions were UNCONSTITUTIONAL
Who among us is safe? NONE of us. Dedicated public servants are leaving their posts because of death threats.
3:35 SCHIFF yields back
We’ve been reminded today that our institutions can’t defend themselves.
3:38 PM · Jun 21, 2022
CHENEY 3:36 The American people have not yet heard from CIPILLONE.
We think they deserve to hear from him.
3:37 THOMPSON closing
[harpie: YES, we do!]
Hey harpie, do you recall which election official’s 15-year-old was at home alone when Trump’s mob showed up to protest? I can’t find it nor recall who it was. Any help you can offer would be great, thanks!
Wasn’t she the daughter of either Benson or Nessel in Michigan?
I thought the reference was to a male election worker, not Benson. I’ll have to swag what I’m writing, thanks anyhow.
Sorry, Rayne. I missed the man talking about his son until last night. I was thinking of something that happened in 2020.
Pennsylvania House Speaker Bryan Cutler. Googled “state election official 15 son home alone mob threat” … Returned AP article at
Thanks, that’s exactly what I thought I’d heard but didn’t catch the name.
Sorry, Rayne. I started looking for that, but you got the answer before I found anything. I’ll post the rest of this at the end.
3:41 PM · Jun 21, 2022
3:43 PM · Jun 21, 2022
[AGAIN, I really appreciate and would like to recommend Aaron RUPAR’s VERY well done twitter video-threads. He recently began a subscription newsletter as well.]
And to think Trump is still allowed to be out there trying to overturn the election…amazing.
And to think he has been neither charged not convicted of ANYTHING. What in the world is up with that comment? That is called due process, if you don’t like it move to another country. Jeebus.
18 U.S. Code § 371 – Conspiracy to commit offense or to defraud United States
If two or more persons conspire either to commit any offense against the United States, or to defraud the United States, or any agency thereof in any manner or for any purpose, and one or more of such persons do any act to effect the object of the conspiracy, each shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than five years, or both
Kind of seems obvious….
Stop. You think you are schooling me on the law with this kind of bunk about a charge never made to date? You are not, just wasting my time. STOP. And again bullshit on the internet is NOT what occurs in a trial court. Waste somebody else’s time. We don’t have time for this nonsense, as Rayne reminded you at the start of the day.
wow. I mean I felt this hearing. Listening to the young woman Sadya and her mom had me in tears.. I have an adult son who fills half of his home w/survival foods…has stopped talking to me for weeks on end….and bombards my emails w/his bitchute/Q/Trump crap. I wrote on my deferred property taxes form where it asked for emergency contact, right? I wrote them that I used to put down my son but I can’t because of all the above mentions. He’s SCREAMED at me and then I do and it’s been horrible. So today’s hearing? I thought it was brilliant. I appreciated how we got an update on future characters of this play via Cheney.
lots of opinion here..it felt so good to cry during Sadya’s testimony. I hope her and her family sued trumps ass. thanks. Oh and Big Kudo’s to Rayney for linking all of these parts of the hearing. How great is that!
Ollie, crying in my book is healthy. A good cleanser. I cried too.
Thanks Rayne. This hearing was raw listening to the threats, hateful words and attacks the election reps and workers had to endure.
Good for brave Shaye and her mother Lady Ruby for coming forward speaking their truth. I cried. Hoping this exposure will help them to move forward with new support from people who are caring and compassionate.
My first impression is that was an effective hearing, except then I remember ABC had Chris Christie commenting during the recesses in their live stream, the Governor who closed a bridge to punish an opponent, and he managed to get in a false equivalency referring to the objections to certification, the few grumbles in 2000 after the Bush Gore as somehow analogous to what happened last year, and I realized that if the hearing were effective I would be able to point to some meaningful change.
I don’t know. Maybe the number to watch is Republicans who think Trump should be charged with a crime. In one poll this number was 15%. If it reaches 30 or 40% maybe the GOP might awaken from this fever.
I stumbled across Christie. What an ass. Blaming it on Bush / Gore. That’s hard to figure.
And do you know who was involved in Bridgegate?
Yep, now trying to sell himself as part of team normal.
Enablers piss me off beyond belief. Brad Raffensperger and Rusty Bowers were enablers of Republican shenanigans and I imagine they both benefited in their own political careers from gerrymandering and other types of legal systems to gain and retain their power. Now the genie is out of the bottle and it is rebounding on them. Now they, their families and who knows, maybe even their friends, are in danger because they had enough integrity to do their jobs. Now they have a sense of what it’s like to be targeted, harassed, and hounded.
Not that they’ll change their tune, unfortunately. Look at Steve Scalise, for example.
I’m only halfway through the hearings now and have not yet read all the comments here, so sorry if I’m going through plowed ground. Quite surprisingly, this hearing is by far the most upsetting for me, making me teary for all the suffering inflicted and for the direct assault on sacred institutions. For me it is setting off alarm bells and flashing red lights with the urgent question, “Who the hell was organizing all this behind the scenes?!!” How did the communications go out to the Proud Boys, etc. Perhaps most of you had already been thinking of things this way, but I had been assuming a heavy dose of giving oblique orders and a lot of tacit communication. It seems clear to me now that pressure on these state officials, especially protests, were organized by more than just Trump naming people in tweets. How did the communications work?
As an aside, these hearings can also be viewed as above all else, aiming to rehabilitate the Republican Party. Apparently, the more sanctimonious one is, the greater the chance of courageously standing up for the constitution. One would think that America’s respect for the rule of law has gone unblemished until Trump. Anyway, not to go on about it, but sleaze balls who have devoted their lives to reprehensible political behavior are what stands between us and loss of the America we all love so much. By that, I mean the America that gives lip service to equal treatment under the law and pretends to unwavering defense of democracy.
It is absolutely the best 1/6 “hearing” to date. Which is not saying much.
I know that’s high praise, lol.
more of an episode 2-3 guy, mainly because that’s the most obvious conviction waiting to happen (Eastman) so far…. in my def not a lawyer opinion.
But this one most certainly made me feel the most bummed out about the vibe of the next few elections. oof.
As tuxspeedo said. “that’s high praise”.
Without expressing an opinion about the absolute value of this series of hearings, I am encouraged that the 1/6 committee seems to be improving each hearing. I hope that trend continues.
But these are much better than most other public hearings I can remember. I wonder whether the difference is “so few Republicans on the committee”, or “most of the members checked their egos at the door, and decided they don’t each need to ask uncoordinated questions for five minutes apiece”. (/s)
Bowers testimony in particular was needed.
Sure. But don’t get the wrong idea about who and what he is.
Here are the links to gofundme pages for Georgia election workers Ruby Freeman and Shaye Moss.
To support Ruby, you can use this link: http://www.gofundme.com/f/bn596-ne….
To support Shaye, you can use this link: http://www.gofundme.com/f/ydvf5-a-….
longtime lurker, new EW donor during Sussman trial, first post
Thank you for those links, Dianne. Welcome to emptywheel.
you done Goode. :~)
So, shorthand for something my very religious mother told me:
“The smallest good deed does more than the grandest prayer”
…shall now be know as a…Goode Deed
I’m stunned by what I just watched. Perhaps it’s not as much evidence to convict people, but that hearing certainly struck at the heart of what this is all about. The current state of our democracy and the meaning and motivation of the assaults we are seeing were summed up by Shaye Moss as she explained that her ancestors did not have the right to vote, that she was always taught to exercise and treasure her right to be represented, and that now she has been threatened into no longer participating enthusiastically in the election process. The word “lynching” is too often used lightly, but anyone who can hear that and not think about lynching as a former tool to keep black voters away from the polls is not tuned in to the history of the south. In fact, Ms. Moss mentioned a message saying she was lucky it’s not 1920. This was a direct reference to lynching. A devastating day at the hearings and a sobering day for America. This is where we are.
Just one more thought. I grew up in Georgia when racism was still active and open. My high school was forcibly integrated when I was in the 11th grade. I won’t tell upsetting stories, just know that I grew up white in a belligerently racist culture. The flip side of the ongoing racist assaults on voting rights is that at moments during this hearing I was deeply moved by the fact that these two beautiful women were getting their day on national television, that white Congresspeople were addressing them with respect. When her grandparents were that age in Georgia–at the time of my youth–the destruction of their lives would have gone largely unremarked and certainly unavenged. We must remove this lynch mob from free and civilized society.
I’m disgusted but not stunned. I consider myself well informed but not obsessed with what’s happened since Trump’s golden escalator ride. Threatening violent harm to people if they won’t do his bidding is what happens before breakfast. Add the opportunity to frighten two Black women from small town Georgia means he and Rudy have hit a double of racism and misogyny; Rudy intimating they’re drug dealers for good measure.
I want to know if the FBI offered Ruby Freeman protection or offered to take her to a safe location in January of 2021. What about this evening? Does anyone have their backs tonight?
If I understood Republican State Party Chair (and fake elector) Andrew Hitt’s testimony correctly, I thought I heard him say that he felt deceived because he and some of his fellow fake electors were not told that key White House lawyers disapproved of the fake elector scheme. Implying that he would have refused to put his name on the fake elector certificates if he had know (unless he is fudging after the fact). Way to throw your peeps under the bus, Donald. https://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/watch/jan-6-committee-plays-video-on-trump-campaign-s-fake-elector-plot-142534213767
Time to print up “Fake Electors for Trump” tee shirts.
What the F did Hitt think it was? He should have realized that it was illegal from the get-go. The official electors were the ones on the ballot in November, not chosen afterward in an attempt to override the votes of the majority.
Yes, he definitely falls into the he is either stupid or evil conundrum.
Yeah. Or both.
He self-described as a willing idiot, giving me the idea that he self-categorizes as stupid.
I’ve only commented a couple times here but I’m a consistent reader of this site and the great work by Dr Wheeler et al. Also, IAmostdefNAL, just a nurse here in AZ, but love the info I read here. I know bmaz, rayne, and others hate the “RICO” word, but today on Rawstory, they showed twitter posts by Laurence Tribe, constitutional Harvard law professor, who taught Roberts, Garland, and Pres. Obama, calling for just that, Rico charges against Trump and his “criminal enterprise.” Those were his words not mine. I believe you guys when you’ve said that doesn’t apply in this case, I guess my question is, shouldn’t he of all people be aware that it doesn’t apply here and he’s misinforming the public?
Larry Tribe is nothing but a noisy crank with a public platform at this point. There is no RICO. And, by the way, thank you for being a nurse in AZ. There is nothing small about that, it is huge. And join in and comment more often!
Ok, great to know, and thanks for the encouragement! Stay golden!
Heh, it is 6pm and not even golden hour here yet. Summers are long….
Lol, that was my ponyboy reference, The Outsiders, and yes the summers are long here. I work ICU nights so I can sleep through the heat of day.
Air conditioning may be up there with the wheel and sliced bread.
. . . and electricity.
AC, automatic dishwashers, and automatic clothes dryers fall under the category of Eighth Wonders of the World in my sphere of experience. And yes, Belyn, electricity enabled all three!
NPR already has the TRANSCRIPT up:
Here’s every word from the fourth Jan. 6 committee hearing on its investigation https://www.npr.org/2022/06/21/1105848096/jan-6-committee-hearing-transcript
June 21, 2022 8:47 PM ET
Part of the discussion of the harassment of Pennsylvania House Speaker Bryan Cutler:
Also on that date:
12/30/20 TRUMP/BANNON phone call:
From the Costa/Woodward book:
Just so revolting. Bannon needs to be held accountable for incitement for this but I don’t know how it would ever come about. Too many folks are missing this being hung up on Bannon’s First Amendment rights and not the offense to the public as well as Cutler and family specifically. Thanks for finding this, it’s the rest of the equation which makes it a focused, deliberate attempt to terrorize an elected official (which might be 18 USC 1503?).
11/5/20 9:41 PM [check TZ!] Cleta MITCHELL to EASTMAN:
11/6/20 G. THOMAS to MEADOWS:
“Do not concede. It takes time for the army who is gathering for his back.”
That relates to a comment that’s in moderation above this one:
Axios is reporting the J6 Committee is considering a reschedule:
Rep. Jamie Raskin (D-Md.), a member of the panel, told reporters after the committee’s fourth hearing on Tuesday, “The original hearings would have wrapped up in June, but we are picking up new evidence on a daily basis with enormous velocity.”
They are also considering more installments.
Music to my ears. The new evidence here is perhaps indicating a rush not to be on the wrong side of these increasingly successful Hearings.
The Committee maybe begins to understand they have the makings of a hit show. Crucially this Reality TV Show has real world implications, which, if they keep hammering on, may penetrate some less thick heads out there. And America loves a hit.
Ah yes, the old and known Rusty Bowers has returned already. He would vote for Trump again.
Reminds me of that old definition of insanity–doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.
Each of the three GOP witnesses yesterday said under oath that they had wanted Trump to win. Add to that the previous witnesses like Greg Jacob and Marc Short, etc, AND MIKE PENCE.
That means they, and everyone who voted for TRUMP
and worked toward his AUTOGOLPE, were A-OK with the US government:
– separating kids from their parents and putting them in cages
– selling out our national security to Putin for personal gain
– extorting the government of Ukraine for personal political gain
– assisting KSA in murdering and dismembering a US-resident journalist
– using DHS+ to violently suppress 1st Amend. activity [by certain groups]
– facilitating the religio-dominionist takeover of SCOTUS
– deliberately fvcking up COVID response [partially for personal gain]
– extorting lawmakers to enforce iron fisted rule within the party
– [you all get the idea…it’s too maddening to continue]
THE GOP is a CANCER on US.
Should have included by name, the practically SAINTED LUTTIG.
As Marcy says in her new post:
Marcy, a little later:
Yes. And Bowers is even worse.