When things turned to ‘Ash’: Henry Tarrio’s first witness appears; plus a fight over informants ensues at Proud Boys sedition trial

From emptywheel, 4/2: Thanks to the generosity of emptywheel readers we have funded Brandi’s coverage for the rest of the trial. If you’d like to show your further appreciation for Brandi’s great work, here’s her PayPal tip jar.

The first witness for Henry Tarrio at the now 43-day-old trial was George Meza, a former Proud Boy turned self-professed rabbi who also goes by “Ash Barkoziba.” Meza was discharged from the U.S. military after going AWOL for over six months. These days, as prosecutors elicited, Meza offers prospective converts to Judaism medical exemptions for the Covid-19 vaccine online. 

If the aim of Meza’s testimony was, in some fashion, meant to persuade jurors that the Proud Boys as an organization were tolerant, ideologically passive, or nonviolent or further, that Tarrio’s oversight of the group meant greater standards were enforced that put checks on members who engaged in bigotry or hate, then Meza was unsuccessful. 

Appearing before jurors wearing angular dark-rimmed glasses and a long button-down shirt, Meza’s testimony was often contradictory. On direct examination, he told Tarrio’s counsel Nayib Hassan that he became a third-degree member of the extremist organization but he couldn’t recall when. He told the January 6 committee he joined the group in September or October of 2020.

He told Hassan the Proud Boys were a “reactionary movement” aimed to protect patriotic Americans from communist leftists and flag-burners. Anyone who held supremacist views would be kicked out of the Proud Boys or “should have been,” he said. 

When he was a member and participated in the Ministry of Self-Defense (MOSD) group chat he said he policed it for anti-Semitic and racist commentary. It was a responsibility he took upon himself, he admitted, because the group didn’t “do enough” to eject bigots from its ranks. 

They did, however, eject Meza. 

He was cagey about why he was ousted, his memory foggy on the finer points. During a pointed exchange with prosecutors during cross-examination, Meza also could not remember the exact date he was ousted but insisted it must have been prior to Jan. 3, 2021. Incidentally, Jan. 3 was the same date that members like Proud Boy Gabriel Garcia of Miami texted Tarrio, Biggs, and other members in MOSD that “yes sir, time to stack those bodies in front of Capitol Hill.” 

Prosecutors say evidence shows Meza was in the MOSD chats through Jan. 6 and wasn’t kicked out until after the insurrection. 

When he was an insider, Meza was a member of MOSD as well as the group’s Boots on Ground channel yet another text forum where, according to prosecutors, Tarrio and his now co-defendants Ethan Nordean, Joseph Biggs, Zachary Rehl, and Dominic Pezzola (as well as a host of other Proud Boys charged in separate indictments) coordinated efforts directly or indirectly aimed at disrupting Congress on Jan. 6, 2021. 

The defendants claim the groups were innocuous and largely served as spaces where members could sketch out methods of self-defense against antifa and other perceived enemies of patriots like Donald Trump or his supporters when pro-Trump events were underway. 

The mission of MOSD was about ensuring the “safety of other Proud Boys,” Meza testified.  There was talk of Jan. 6 in MOSD, he said, but he couldn’t recall specific discussions. He also brushed aside suggestions that the group used the space to do things like find “real men” willing to confront police when Jan. 6 rolled around. 

MOSD, he said, was a place where leadership could work toward things like the “thinning out” of members who were unable to curb binge drinking or other unruly behavior at rallies. But at the same time, Meza said Proud Boys did not shy away from taking matters into their own hands when they felt under duress.

After two pro-Trump events in D.C. in November and December 2020 —the Million MAGA March on Nov. 14  and the ‘Stop the Steal’ rally on Dec. 12—the Proud Boys were keyed up. Members had been stabbed during street brawls with antifa, he said. But, he admitted, he didn’t see the stabbings with his own eyes or who started it. 

People got bored. Bored and drunk. And stabbings occurred, he said.

But, he testified, this boys club also sincerely believed it was in the middle of a civil war with antifa. Meza described it as “somewhat of a peaceful civil war… for the most part.” 

Yet, he downplayed the Proud Boys as a drinking club akin to a “fraternity” where “locker room talk” flowed. When one member in MOSD discussed breaking people’s legs or hunting antifa down, for example, Meza said it was hyperbole. 

“It was always reactionary,” he volunteered to Assistant U.S. Attorney Jason McCullough. “It was a lot of poetic hyperbolic statements.” 

“When you’re on the receiving end of violence, does it feel better if it’s just hyperbole?” McCullough asked. 

Defense attorneys objected before he could answer. 

By the time Jan. 6 arrived, Meza testified that he was specifically focused on providing security for Latinos for Trump founder Bianca Gracia. He had been admitted to MOSD after the December 12 rally, he said. Text exhibits indicate Meza was a participant in the MOSD Main chat when Tarrio first out an invitation for a critical video conference hosted on Dec. 29, 2020. 

Ahead of that meeting, defendant Joseph Biggs eagerly told members in MOSD they would soon discuss the “need to make sure guys understand the chain of command” for Jan. 6. In clips from the teleconference played for the jury this February, Proud Boy Charles Donohoe—who has already pleaded guilty conspiracy to obstruct proceedings—is heard emphasizing a need for secrecy among MOSD’s operations.

There would be no social media posts about MOSD, Donohoe urged and at the meeting, Tarrio reiterated this point. Even in the MOSD text channel jurors saw this point was one of several Tarrio listed in a reminder post that was pinned at the top of the channel. When FBI Special Agent Peter Dubrowski testified about the Dec. 29 teleconference, he said while Tarrio, Biggs, and other leaders on the call did not discuss a strategic objective for January 6 that he heard, there was interest for those details expressed by other members. 

Tarrio just wouldn’t come out with it openly, Dubrowski said. He opted to keep information siloed. There was more than one teleconference for MOSD members in the run-up to Jan. 6, Dubrowski testified, but investigators were unable to successfully locate recordings of those videos if they existed. 

As for Meza, he would arrive in Washington on Jan. 5 to stay at the Phoenix Park Hotel.

His mission, he told the jury, was to escort Gracia and others in her entourage as a representative of the Proud Boys on Jan. 6. 

He was to ensure she got to and from the hotel and to the group’s rally. Tarrio, he said, was meant to speak at the Latinos for Trump rally from 10 a.m. to noon though he admitted, Tarrio’s name was never listed on the Latinos for Trump publicity flyer for the 6th. 

The Proud Boys ringleader was arrested on Jan. 4 and promptly received an order to stay out of  D.C. from law enforcement. 

Despite being tapped as security for the high-profile pro-Trump event that the very leader of the Proud Boys was supposed to speak at, Meza testified that he and Tarrio never had any communications about it before Jan. 5.

Further stretching the limits of logical belief, in addition to security for Gracia, Meza told jurors he was there on Jan. 6 as an “independent licensed journalist.” Putting aside the fact that there is no license issued to journalists independent or otherwise, McCullough elicited from the former Proud Boy turned rabbi that he was also interviewing people on the 6th who had never met Proud Boys before. 

The prosecution has alleged that the Proud Boys activated fellow members of their organization on Jan. 6 to breach police lines but further, that they understood their success in applying force to stop the certification would hinge also on raising the hackles of “normies” or everyday people at the rally in Washington. These “normies” were “tools” of the conspiracy, at times, almost as much as some members of the organization were, the government contends. 

McCullough pressed Meza on this point asking him several times if he was positive that he was ousted from MOSD prior to Jan. 3. Presenting a MOSD text chain to the jury, McCullough showed him where a Proud Boy using the handle “BrotherHunter Jake Phillips” told MOSD members: “So are the normies and ‘other’ attendees going to push through police lines and storm the capitol buildings? A few million v. a few hundred coptifa should be enough. I saw a few normie groups rush police lines on the 12th.” 

“Ever see that?” McCullough asked. 

“Never seen it,” Meza said. 

Meza also testified that he didn’t see another comment where “BrotherHunter Jake Phillips” asked, “what would they do if 1 million patriots stormed and took the capitol building. Shoot into the crowd? I think not.” 

Meza did not meet with Proud Boys, including some of the defendants, who gathered at the Washington Monument on the morning of Jan. 6. He told the jury he did not march with any of them when they descended on the Capitol. He said too that he had no cellphone communication with any of them and carried no radio. McCullough, however, showed Meza a picture of himself where a radio is clearly visible on his chest. He stands next to a Proud Boy from Miami he identified as “The Greek.” Also appearing alongside them in the picture is Josh Macias, the co-founder of Vets for Trump. 

This jogged his memory, Meza said. They had radio for the Latinos for Trump event, he said. But they never used them. Someone had given the radios to him but he couldn’t recall who and he said, in any event, they “never figured out how to use them.” 

Former Proud Boy Matthew Greene—who has pleaded guilty to conspiracy and obstruction of an official proceeding already—testified this January that he was tasked to program radios for Proud Boys on Jan. 6 but it wasn’t Tarrio, he told Nayib Hassan, who set him about this project.

When Nick Smith, defense attorney for Proud Boy leader and defendant Ethan Nordean, asked Greene whether those radios were ever used to plan an invasion on the Capitol, Greene also said no. 

Though he said he heard no specific plan for Jan. 6 if it existed, Greene said Proud Boys had steadily grown angrier and angrier as the day approached and members, by December, fully and openly expected a civil war was imminent. 

When Greene traveled to D.C with defendant Dominic Pezzola in a two-car caravan (Pezzola rode in a separate car, Greene rode with New York Proud Boy William Pepe), that hadn’t changed. When things finally clicked into place in his mind, he said, was when he saw Proud Boys lead rioters over barricades for the first time on Jan. 6. 

“Oh shit, this is it,” he recalled thinking.

“I personally had an abstract feeling that Proud Boys were about to be part of something, the tip of the spear, but I never heard specifically what that could be. But as people moved closer to the Capitol, I was in the moment, putting two-and-two together and saying, well, here it is,” Greene testified on Jan. 24. 

Like Meza, Greene was not a high-ranking member of the Proud Boys. 

Greene stuck close to defendant Dominic Pezzola on Jan. 6 as they breached barriers and ascended scaffolding around the Capitol. 

At one point on the 6th, when Greene saw Pezzola clutching a police riot shield, Greene said it was then that he started to question what he was really doing there. Greene stayed close enough to Pezzola long enough to watch him have his picture taken with the riot shield, Pezzola’s hand making the “OK” hand gesture that extremist experts say is associated with the white power movement. Meza told the jury Proud Boys were instructed by the group’s leadership to use the hand signal to antagonize the media. 

Other testimony from Meza was likely just as unhelpful for the defendants.

As video footage played in court from a violent breach of the Columbus Door near the East Rotunda, police clearly struggling to keep the mob at bay, Meza testified that he was escorting two women out of the Capitol after the door was breached. He never saw it breached, he said. He was walking away and three seconds later, the door was open. He asked jurors to believe he never saw protesters stream through that same door 10 to 15 seconds later because things were “so densely populated.” 

He understood the purpose of going to D.C. on Jan. 6 was to “stop the steal,” he testified. And when McCullough asked him plainly whether he believed that the people who went inside the Capitol were “heroes”, Meza was unabashed. 

“Yes I do,” he said. 

Meza’s testimony will resume on Monday since his cross-examination did not conclude Friday. And much to the defense’s chagrin, presiding U.S. District Judge Timothy Kelly has agreed to admit evidence into question that will tie the Proud Boys ever closer to the sedition charge they each face. 

The government wants to cross Meza on a series of key details around Jan. 5 at the Phoenix Park Hotel in downtown D.C. 

This was the same hotel where Tarrio would meet that night with Oath Keepers founder Elmer Stewart Rhodes, who was convicted of seditious conspiracy in November, Bianca Gracia, Joshua Macias, former Oath Keeper attorney Kellye SoRelle and others, in an underground parking garage. 

Prosecutors argue that Meza’s proximity to Gracia as well as his testimony on his stated purpose—security guard for Jan. 6 related events—should grant the government the right to question him about what he heard or what he saw happen in Gracia’s hotel room. 

Judge Kelly was not initially inclined to let this line of examination run, suggesting it was beyond the scope and that conversations in the hotel room prior to a rally were First Amendment-protected activity. But McCullough kept at it. 

“It squarely refutes the idea this is all done for First Amendment [reasons], your honor,” McCullough said. “He is in a room with the head of the Oath Keepers, with the Latino for Trump folks who have just met with Tarrio in a garage earlier that evening and now he is continuing to engage with Bianca who we have heard on direct is thick as thieves—[strike that]. They are very close is what we have heard. That is relevant. There is a connection with this individual when this is all supposed to be about Latinos for Trump and ‘we’re going to a rally from 10 a.m. to 12 p.m.’.”

In a text message extracted from Proud Boy Gabriel Garcia’s phone after Jan. 6, McCullough said Meza said he told other Proud Boys things were “planned in our hotel room the night before by Oath Keepers and Three Percenters. 

In the sentence just before this in the text message, Meza writes, “I’m thrilled with what happened and don’t know why people keep saying it was antifa [or] BLM.” 

Ethan Nordean’s attorney Nick Smith argued this was exculpatory since it appeared to rest responsibility on other extremist groups. But these were Meza’s statements, Kelly found, and therefore, he now agreed with the government: they were relevant and Meza could be questioned about them because “at least,” Kelly said, it was an “implication” that Proud Boys planned to stop the certification with the other groups. 

Tarrio’s next witness is teed up for Monday after much commotion: FBI informant Jennylyn Salinas, also known as “Jenny Loh.” 

Loh’s anticipated appearance threw proceedings into disarray last week as defense attorneys claimed they had no idea Loh was an informant. Loh maintains she told her handlers nothing about her interactions with the Proud Boys and that once the government became aware that she could be called to testify in the case, her informant relationship ended completely. Prosecutors say Loh, who was associated with  Latinos for Trump, was an informant from April 2020 through this January and only received a single payment from the bureau after sharing footage with agents of people harassing her at home. Loh has said that her communications with the FBI were not about Proud Boys but the threat that antifa posed. 

Sabino Jauregui, another defense attorney representing Tarrio, told Judge Kelly on Friday that Loh would be able to testify that in at least 100 different Telegram channels or group chats with multiple Proud Boys, she never saw any chatter of plans to storm the Capitol on Jan. 6. How relevant that will be remains to be seen. There’s no indication that Loh, even if she was a member of dozens of Proud Boy channels, would be hipped to information closely guarded by leadership. 

The government has maintained that Loh never informed on Proud Boys specifically. Jauregui insisted she would often talk to her FBI handler about Biggs and Tarrio in particular. Defense attorneys claim Loh tried to convince one of the defendants to get rid of his attorney.

McCullough offered to share a 36-minute recorded interview with Judge Kelly involving Loh and her FBI handler where, the prosecutor said, it would become clear that Loh was not reporting on Proud Boys.

Kelly has been treading carefully around informant issues that continue to arise in the trial. The defense has issued subpoenas to several witnesses who they say are confidential human sources that would vindicate the Proud Boys. For example, Judge Kelly recently quashed a subpoena from the defense for  Massachusetts Proud Boy Kenny Lizardo. Lizardo attended the meeting with Tarrio and Rhodes in the parking garage at the Phoenix. 

Lizardo, Kelly found,  had a “reporting relationship” with the FBI and intended to invoke his Fifth Amendment right if called. 

150 replies
    • JAFO_NAL says:

      Earlier today my repeated attempts to open this topic were unsuccessful. Cloud services problem? Thanks to Brandi for the detailed coverage.

  1. StillHopeful says:

    I could access, same as always.

    To Rayne: I updated my user name from Hopeful a couple of months ago.

    [Thanks for updating your username to meet the 8 letter minimum. /~Rayne]

  2. Vinnie Gambone says:

    These dudes are dangerous and , it seems, gleefully violent. But i had hoped they’d be connected at some point back to Snot Rag of a human Roger Stone and the Willard War room.

    Looks now as those assholes walk, and live to crime another day.

    Proud boys , oath keepers, etc. seem low level patsies, the Oswalds for the phantom now rarely mentioned AR15 toters, and the pipe bomber.

    Smith will run out of time before he gets to any of that and a new GOP AG
    ( god forbid) shuts this investigation down.

    Maybe feds did do a geo fence pull on the AR15 tree line area, and do know who the AR15 people are and i should just stop flapping my lips.

    How many black folks were shot dead by police for the least show of force ( or none) against LE ?

    Next insurection go with Trump’s wishes

  3. Johanna_26MAR2023_1818h says:

    Love your reporting! But as a lowly nurse who is following this very closely I’d offer some corrections:

    -“Prosecutors say Loh, who was associated with Latinos for Trump, was an informant from April 2020 through this January”

    Per the docs from FBI, the informant was active from April *2021* to January 2023, when they were informed of her subpoena

    -I think Mesa is actually spelled Meza (I believe you corrected this on your live tweets)

    [Welcome to emptywheel. Please choose and use a unique username with a minimum of 8 letters. We are moving to a new minimum standard to support community security. Because your username is shared with a number of other community members, it will be temporarily changed to match the date/time of your first know comment until you have a new compliant username. Thanks. /~Rayne]

    • harpie says:

      9:16 AM · Mar 27, 2023

      Kelly: Regarding the video with witness on stand now (George Meza/Ash Barkoziba) – I do think the video is fair game for impeachment and bias for the witness. I’ll give an instruction along those lines but I think the clearest basis is bias and around edges for impeachment / Kelly: The govt will be able to proceed with that video.

      Ryan Reilly embeds that video, here:

      11:18 AM · Mar 28, 2023

      “Heck, in my opinion, we didn’t do enough… Fuck yeah what happened in D.C. was called for, and it should have happened sooner, and it was the most patriotic act committed in this country in the last 100 years.” George Meza, Proud Boys defense witness #RabbiPB [VIDEO]

      • harpie says:

        10:07 AM · Mar 24, 2023

        Since George Meza aka #RabbiPB is testifying for the defense in the Proud Boys trial, let’s remember that on Jan 6 he watched the brutal attacks on the Columbus Doors. Here he is at 2:38 PM, 8s before the breach and 2s after. You can see his Israeli flag patch. 1/

        In the morning, George Meza was at the Lot 7 rally, like the other Proud Boy defense witness Michale Graves (who opened for the convicted Stewart Rhodes). Here is Meza with Joshua Macias, arrested for bringing guns to a Philly vote-counting center. 2/ [PHOTO][THREAD]

    • harpie says:

      9:19 AM Brandi
      Female CHS will be allowed.

      Now, there’s another witness for defense, another informant, a male, that is being discussed.

      Kelly suggests this person may be able to testify under a pseudonym;

      govt says this person’s name has already been discussed in media by defense and there’s no threat posed […]

      • harpie says:

        Female CHS is Jenny Loh.
        10:12 AM Brandi:

        So, defense releases Loh with court’s blessing.
        After all that hubbub.


    • harpie says:

      10:23 AM Brandi:

      AUSA Jason McCullough resumes cross of defense witness George Meza for Proud Boy ringleader Henry “Enrique” Tarrio. […]

      McCullough now shows Meza a post he wrote on January 4, 2021 at 1:31 p.m.
      If that’s what it states, Meza says.

      McCullough asks him to affirm date and Meza gets snappy: No I get it, this is over two years ago

      He won’t say he wrote it, just “that’s what it states” […]

      McC: There’s a trend of violent rhetoric?
      Meza: The vast material in this chat had to do with protecting PBs, this is the riff-raff.

      McCullough: And that riff-raff includes Gabriel Garcia?
      Meza: Correct
      Mc: Gabriel Garcia who was on the private plane with Tarrio (in Nov)?
      Meza: Correct
      McC: Garcia, who Tarrio brought into MOSD, your testimony is he’s riff-raff, is that correct?
      Meza: No, that’s not what I said

    • harpie says:

      10:38 AM Brandi:

      McCullough now shows Meza a message he sent in MOSD chat dated Jan. 9 – almost a week after he claims he was ousted.

      “This can’t be accurate, I was kicked out of the chat.”

      McCullough looks at him. Waits a beat. Unblinking. Then: Mr. Meza, are you denying you were in the chat?

      Meza: I cant tell what chat this belongs to. Its hard to believe they would let me back in after they kicked me out…The average proud boy didn’t even know this chat existed… I question this stmt if I made it at all in this chat

      Sidebar. Husher on.

      Husher off. Now, an exhibit is published to the jury. This would be the Meza text in MOSD Main 1 that he is presently denying from the witness stand […]

      Mcc: You recall making a video ‘if not now then when?’
      Meza: Yes
      McC: And that video was about 1/6?
      Meza: Yes
      Mc: And you began and ended that video with “uhuru brothers”
      Meza: Yes sir

    • harpie says:

      11:05 AM Brandi:

      Nayib Hassan for Henry Tarrio now conducting redirect. […]

      Meza on Proud Boys: The core of our organization s reactionary, we do things other people don’t because we don’t want innocent Americans harmed.

      H: What do you mean by innocent and in what way are they harmed?
      Meza: For political reasons. We don’t believe someone who wants to support their political candidate should be bullied. […]

      11:12 AM
      In the video, if not now, when, were those your sentiments or Mr. Tarrios?
      Meza says these are his views.
      Tarrio, he adds, felt the opposite and begins to volunteer unsolicited testimony.
      Objection. Sustained.

      • harpie says:

        11:23 AM Brandi:

        Hassan: And in re: to Mr. Tarrio, would you present him as more of a showboater or not a showman?
        Objection. Relevance. Scope. Sustained on scope.

        Hassan: Did Tarrio like to razzle dazzle the crowd?
        Objection. Same. Sustained.

        Hassan: What was Tarrio’s persona within PBs?
        Meza: Essentially, the chairman

        Hassan: And as chairman, did he like to razzle dazz —
        Objection. Sustained.

        What would Tarrio do in regard to the media?
        Objection, scope, foundation, relevance, 403 etc etc
        Kelly: Sustained as to scope.
        Hassan: I have no further questions.

        Witness steps down // Jury leaves for break
        Kelly and lawyers are discussing limiting instructions for Meza video.

        Hernandez says instruction sounds like its adding, not limiting.

        Kelly says: I’m not adding. I’m limiting.

    • harpie says:

      11:25 AM Parloff:

      [Well, this is obviously subjective, but I would consider that witness to have been an unmitigated disaster. … ] /64

      11:45 AM Brandi [responding]

      And that’s being nice.

    • harpie says:

      11:54 AM Brandi:

      Henry “Enrique” Tarrio has called his next witness in the Proud Boys seditious conspiracy trial unfolding at the federal courthouse here in Washington.

      His first witness was …. not… great…for him.
      Next up: Fernando Alonso […]

      Who did you have to beat up to get that fourth degree/
      Alonso laughs: “Nobody.”
      He says usually you get the fourth degree when you’ve suffered a hardship. He lost a huge business deal because he got doxxed by antifa, he says.

      • harpie says:

        12:22 PM Brandi:

        Jauregui: You stopped around noon more or less?
        Alonso: more or less
        J: Was that the plan to stop there (at food trucks)?
        A: It wasn’t a plan, that’s where we just stopped after the prayer.
        J: Any kind of map or itinerary?
        A: It was basically on the go

        Why were people standing around?
        Alonso: There was no objective at this point. Basically we were standing around.

        [harpie: Well, no one asked me, but I think
        people are standing around because
        TRUMP started his speech an hour late,
        AND he spoke much longer than planned.]

      • harpie says:

        [Back from lunch]

        1:59 PM Brandi:

        Jauregui asks if PBs had a plan and intended to stop transfer of power from Trump to Biden.
        Alonso: If that would have been the case, I would have left the club that day.
        Then, Alonso says…

        If I can be frank, it’s kind of offensive, that we would even fathom that idea. In our chats, we may be knuckleheads saying stupid things but a lot of us are grown men with families and education. Its insulting.

        Fists balled up in the air, that means freedom, it’s “uhuru,” Alonso says, swahili for freedom.
        Jauregui: At some pt, what did mob do?
        A: What did they do?
        J: Yes
        A: They started going toward hte capitol, this was nothing as PBs that we planned to do…
        Obj. non responsive.

        The objection was sustained;
        Judge Kelly tells Alonso, what did the crowd do?
        They went in, Alonso says.

      • harpie says:

        2:05 PM Brandi:

        Jauregui asks about Henry Tarrio. What does Alonso make of him?
        [ALONSO] He is one of the calmest people I’ve ever seen. To see the abuse he took in these chats. To see the things he was called. He’s a better man than I am.
        “I thought he was a great leader,” Alonso says of Tarrio.

        J: What did Tarrio think of BLM?

        BRANDI [and harpie]: (Not sure why Alonso is allowed to answer what he thinks Tarrio thinks of BLM)

        But he says Tarrio thought BLM had a right to say whatever they wanted.

        Did Tarrio plan to engage in violence on 1/6?
        Absolutely not.

        And how did Tarrio feel about law enforcement?
        Alonso says Tarrio respected law enforcement. […]

      • harpie says:

        2:13 PM Brandi:

        Jauregui asks Alonso about doxxing. Alonso says he’s been doxxed today.
        objection. relevance. sustained.
        Jauregui tries it again, objection is sustained.

        That ends direct examination of Proud Boy Fernando Alonso by Sabino Jauregui.
        Judge Kelly asks for a sidebar.

    • harpie says:

      ALONSO on cross:

      2:19 PM Brandi:

      AUSA Conor Mulroe is up to conduct cross of Fernando Alonso.
      I want to start where Jauregui left off, questions about what Tarrio had in mind.

      Recall that?
      Yeah […]

      You were able to testify to this jury that you knew 100% of what was in [TARRIO’s] his mind in 1/6?
      How many of Tarrio’s private comms with Biggs, Nordean, Bertino privy to?
      How about PB elders? MOSD leadership?
      None. […]

      You yourself have communicated 1-1 w/Tarrio?
      In person and over Telegram, yes, Alonso says.
      He answered you back 1-1 on Telegram?
      Of course, Alonso says.

      • harpie says:

        2:45 PM Brandi:
        re: Video of “antifa” woman getting knocked out with a PB helmet at 11/14/20 rally.

        Alonso: Its not that you take pleasure, but I’m sorry, somebody who was trying to use a knife on our guy and got knocked out, of course i took pleasure in that.. she stole someone’s flag, she had a knife…

        Mulroe then shows Alonso a text chain found in Tarrio’s found. Alonso reviews it before its shown to jury. He gets defensive right away. It’s not him, he says.

        Mulroe: Is it your testimony that there is an impersonator in the chat using your handle?
        There’s crosstalk.
        Alonso says the phone # shown isn’t his, where did he get that?
        Mulroe says (light paraphrase) questions go one way, him to Alonso

        Mulroe, reading from exhibit:
        You never said ‘Put the video of that predator bitch -‘
        There’s an objection and sidebar. Husher on.

        Husher off.
        You were member of a chat, Miami Dad OG?
        I was a member of?
        Miami Dade OG?
        You were not the person saying, put the video of predator bitch getting smacked

        Hernandez objects,
        Kelly forcefully tells her, I’ve already overruled the objection

        • harpie says:

          Mulroe tries it again: You said someone was impersonating you when they said, “put up video of predator bitch and say page is fundraising to get her new teeth lol…”
          Alonso: I’m not saying someone was impersonating me, but it doesn’t sound like something I would say

      • harpie says:

        This is another pretty bad cross for defense, I think.

        3:06 PM Brandi:

        Husher off.
        Mulroe: Mr. Alonso, your view of this war was that police and federal law enforcement had chosen the wrong side?
        Alonso: No
        Now, another exhibit.
        It’s a text from Alonso again.

        Mulroe: That’s you isn’t it?
        What was your question sir? Alonso says after reading it.
        Now the jury sees the msg

        On 12/3/20: I’ve been saying this for awhile, antifuck is backed by Dems, police and FBI. They’re like that all over the world. Why would here be any different?

        Mulroe asks about a chat that seems to catch Alonso a bit unaware.
        M: Do you remember if Tarrio was a member of a chat “croqeutta wars”

        Alonso laughs at this at first.
        Mulroe asks him if he’s surprised they found it.
        A: It was a parody chat, we sat around a cuban cafe…

        Mulroe: Gabriel Garcia was a member?
        Alonso affirms.
        Would you consider Gabriel Garcia riff-raff?
        Alonso: I don’t consider him at all.
        Gilbert Fonticoba was part of Croquetta Wars and MOSD?
        Dont know him… and yes [MORE]

      • harpie says:

        3:36 PM Brandi:

        [M]: In this chat, you all had discussions about ways Trump could hold onto presidency after the election?
        Alonso: We may have talked about those things, it was several years ago

        Mulroe: But as of 12/17/2020, you believed Trump may have a complicated plan to hold the presidency?

        Jauregui objects. Overruled.
        Mulroe: Recognize your Telegram handle?
        Alonso: Mmhm.
        M: Recognize this long msg in chat?
        A: Yes
        Remember this about dueling electors from seven states, trump sitting on trump cards? This is a msg you sent?
        Its a msg fwd’d to me, Alonso says

        Hernandez for Rehl and Nick Smith for Nordean object, relevance, 403. Overruled.

        The message shown to jurors is too long for me to type it out, so I can share it later once its available on public record of exhibits. [MORE]

      • harpie says:

        3:47 PM · Mar 27, 2023

        Husher off.
        Msg you sent about legal challenges was sent 12/17, correct?
        Alonso: Correct

        By Dec. 24, you had more drastic ideas in mind?
        Alonso: When you said I had more drastic… I’m not sure…
        Mulroe shows him a chat with his Telegram handle. […]

        Now the chat is shown:
        Al (Tourno/Tourna) writes: yeah yeah, unleash the kraken trust the plan blah blah when do we start stacking bodies on WH lawn?
        And Alonso replies on Jan. 7?
        Alonso: Yeah

        Al writes: RINOs first, make the democrats watch
        Alonso writes: yes

        (Alonso also testifies that he thinks RINOs mean someone who has been in office too long)
        Mulroe: The RINOs were the bodies that you thought needed to be stacked?
        Alonso, unsure of q: They are spies?
        M: The bodies were the RINOs bodies?
        Alonso: this is lockerroom talk […]

        • harpie says:

          4:00 PM Brandi:

          Al: If we were storming the Capitol, that’d be a different story.
          That’s what he said, Alonso affirms.

          Mulroe: And that didn’t disgust you? Didn’t insult you when Al talked about storming the Capitol in the PB chat?
          A: I didn’t pay attention to it… didn’t think anything of it

          Mulroe scrolls through the chat and shows Alonso where he writes that Jan 6 determines everything, the joint ceritfication of the votes…

          Then he writes: “us going is not for antifa, it’s going as patriots”

          He discusses being “among the normies” who will feel safe with PBs […]

          More detail on Alonso text msg saying “us going [on 1/6] is not about antifa” – cutting against a key prong of the defense’s argument. [link to Parloff]

          Parloff https://twitter.com/rparloff/status/1640443552646701086
          3:59 PM · Mar 27, 2023

          M: then you said “us going is not about antifa. it’s about us being patriots and standing among normies. the purpose is what will happen that day.”
          … then you sent longer message poking fun at people who didn’t want to get behind [this]. [More]

      • harpie says:

        4:22 PM · Mar 27, 2023

        M: Did someone standing near you say rioters had entered senate chamber itself?
        A: They might have, I don’t recall everything

        Mulroe: You don’t recall that?
        Alonso: Its not that I don’t recall, but i d remember min by min

        Mulroe: And there was a time when a woman shared with you that a woman had been shot? Someone standing near you told you this?
        Alonso: Someone had come out and said someone had been shot, yes.

        M: And when you heard that, all you wanted to know was whether, your words, “pence betrayed trump?”
        Objections overruled.

        M: When you heard someone got shot, all you wanted to know was whether Pence had betrayed Trump?
        Alonso: The way you’re asking me. No. You’re saying that my only focus was this. that’s not my only focus. at that pt I’m thinking about kids, I’m sad my mother passed away a year prior but to say that’s my only focus is wrong.

        Mulroe: When you heard a woman was shot inside, all you said was, pence had betrayed trump and what you said also was: had they certified the vote?
        A: Im sure I had asked if it had already been certified or not. Im sure I asked about the girl that was murdered inside the capitol […]

    • harpie says:

      4:43 PM Brandi

      Conor Mulroe ends his cross.
      Sabino Jauregui is up for redirect now and he starts out asking Alonso how he feels about being attacked by the govt. Objection. Sustained. Then Jauregui asks how Alonso feels about being attacked for the clothes he wears. Objection. Sustained.

      Jauregui asks how Alonso feels abboubt bbebing attacekd for his speech. Objection. Sustained.
      Judge asks to speak to counsel on sidebar. It lasts for a few minutes. Then after its over, Jauregui asks Alonso how he feels being attacked about the people he associates with.

      Alonso says: I’m proud of being a Proud Boy […]

      4:56 PM Jauregui has ended his redirect of defense witness Fernando Alonso.

      Now there’s a sidebar with the husher on.

      Husher off.
      Kelly dismisses the jury for the day, tells them we’ll be back at 9 a.m tomorrow ET (Tuesday). He also warns them – no media! no independent investigation!

      And that does it. I’ll be back in the morning for @emptywheel

  4. harpie says:

    While we’re waiting for court logistics to be figured out [juror illness and Rehl illness]

    Marcy retweeted Emma Brown this morning:

    Activist group led by Ginni Thomas received nearly $600,000 in anonymous donations Funding for group that battled ‘cultural Marxism’ was channeled through right-wing think tank, Post investigation finds https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/2023/03/28/ginni-thomas-crowdsourcers-anonymous-donations/ [] Boburg / Brown // March 28, 2023 at 6:00 a.m.

    Crowdsourcers for Culture and Liberty

    This is some great new info on something I brought up the other day in response to Brandi, here, about the May 2019 Conservative Action Project [CAP] meeting:

    • harpie says:

      […] The previously unreported donations to the fledgling group Crowdsourcers for Culture and Liberty were channeled through a right-wing think tank in Washington that agreed to serve as a funding conduit from 2019 until the start of last year, according to documents and interviews. The arrangement, known as a “fiscal sponsorship,” effectively shielded from public view details about Crowdsourcers’ activities and spending, information it would have had to disclose publicly if it operated as a separate nonprofit organization, experts said. […]

      • Ginevra diBenci says:

        harpie, thank you for bringing this up. The funding shell game described here is straight out of the Leonard Leo (Federalist Society impresario and general money-funneler for right-wing causes) playbook. I will once again recommend Anne Nelson’s Shadow Network as a great way to learn the origins of the machine that controls the GOP, SCOTUS and way too much else.

        Not always but way too often it’s the same obscenely rich white men, whose lives will never be scraped by the cultural degradation they fomented–not because they believed in any of it but simply to keep more money for themselves.

        • RipNoLonger says:

          Anne Nelson’s book sits on the desk by my side. Her list of organizations and interconnections is invaluable. Much like Marcy Wheeler’s site – a very valuable resource.

  5. harpie says:

    11:18 AM · Mar 28, 2023 [VIDEO]

    1/9/21 George MEZA / Ash Barkoziba on MOSD Main-2 chat

    Allright? This is what you told Americans, that their only means of representation, the ballot box, was stolen from them, to come to the Capitol to stop the steal. Fuck, if not now, then when? Heck, in my opinion, we didn’t do enough, and now, you’re gonna throw us under the bus? Fuck yeah! What happened in DC was called for, and it should have happened sooner. And it was the most patriotic act committed in this country in the last one hundred years. When the lines of civil discourse have been severed, violence is the only language tyrants understand. And the left knows this very well. But, I’ll tell you, why every politician condemned that glorious event. That is because it represents accountability. And, please, stop mentioning antifa and BLM. This was our battle, and essentially our victory. We weren’t kicked out of the Capitol. We chose to leave. If anything, we should hide the fact that antifa was involved in any way. What…are you ashamed of what happened, right? You attack tyrants and they’ll tell you that everyone who was doing the attacking, or who had the balls to attack was antifa. I’m sure there were many patriots who did what others did not have the internal fortitude to do, including our fallen hero, Ashleigh Babbitt, who are now getting called antifa, having their legacy tarnished by some on [air quotes] our side, who are…who are ashamed of what transpired. So, every time you tell anyone that we were set up in any way, you’re telling them that you would not have acted unless someone else wasn’t holding your hand. And, I’ll tell you why the media keeps putting out this narrative that it wasn’t Republicans but antifa. It’s not to cover you, but to cover themselves, to cower to the left, so that the left, the ones in power now, could allow them to coexist. So, don’t be ashamed, and wear what transpired as a badge of honor, because antifa, BLM and Democrats are OUR bitches. I was there, and I saw that it was patriots who led, and who still lead the way. [hand gesture] Ohurru, brothers.

  6. harpie says:

    9:27 AM Brandi:

    Nick Smith for Ethan Nordean is at the dais. A witness is already on the stand. It’s a man, presumably the CHS/informant Nordean wished to call.

    9:27 AM Parloff:

    The witness has taken the stand. [White man, stocky, short hair, dark suit, white shirt, no tie.] The sidebar has ended. The jury is coming in. /14

    This CHS is identified only as “Aaron”

    • harpie says:

      9:33 AM Brandi:

      Smith: You understand agent that has a relationship with a source is known as a handler agent.
      Aaron: Yes

      S: Did you inform agents you’d be traveling to DC on 1/6?
      A: I was asked if i was planning to go
      S: What was your response?
      A; Yes
      (He speaks very softly)

      Smith: What was agent’s response?
      A: he asked me to try and see if i could locate someone in DC who had nothing to do w/PBs to figure out why they were there, if they were there, what their motivation was
      S: Agent didn’t ask u to go to DC or march with PBs?
      A: Correct

      Aaron says agent said if there was violence, they’d want him to tell them.
      Smith asks about guidance given to him about what he could or couldn’t do…
      Aaron: If there’s an emergency situation and to protect myself from physical harm or worse, I have to do something minor like if I’m surrounded by antifa and I have to spray paint on a wall or break a window to get them to leave me alone… Aaron continued: that could be explained and would be much better than me being severely hurt.

      Smith: Was it your understanding that the authorization you rec’d related to antifa alone?
      Aaron: Yes

      S: Did you discuss any other potential bad activities unrelated to antifa?
      Aaron: I don’t recall

      9:33 AM Parloff:

      had a relationship with primarily one FBI agent, sometimes someone else would show up with him. The main FBI connection is called a “handler agent.” i was asked if i was planning to go [to J6], and said yes. Agent asked me to try to see if i could locate someone in DC that had nothing to do with PBs who could say why they were there.
      Agent did not ask him to go to DC or march with PBs.

      S: was there expectation you’d report back?
      yes, if there was violence, they’d have wanted that. if there’s an emergency situation, to protect myself from physical harm or worse, i wouldn’t get in trouble if i did something minor [like petty vandalism, spray painting] in an act of self-preservation.

      S: your authorization related to antifa alone?

    • harpie says:

      10:00 AM Brandi:

      S: you recall moment when crowd started moving past barriers? What was your reaction?
      A: I thought there was a barrier over there
      S: Were you expecting that or not/
      A: I was not. I was confused at the moment
      S: Were you surprised?
      A: yes

      Smith: Did you communicate with your agent at this time (Aaron’s FBI handler agent)
      Aaron affirms. He called texted around the time he observed this breach. He tells Smith, he was still surprised at this moment.

      Smith: What did you say to agent?
      A: IDK if i said it exactly, but i said, PBs didn’t do this. From my POV, it was herd mentality. it looked like the trump supporters who had walked up had done it, from where i was stationed twd the back, judging by the movements of their flags

      Apologies – it wasn’t a call from Aaron to his handler but a text.
      Smith shows that text to the jury now between Aaron and his handler.
      The timestamp shows Aaron’s msg sent at 12:02 p.m. [TZ?] Smith says agent was an hour behind.

    • harpie says:

      Smith for NORDEAN done.
      Hernandez for REHL:

      10:22 AM Brandi:

      Carmen Hernandez, defense atty for Zachary Rehl is now up.
      You already indicated you don’t know Rehl?
      Aaron affirms.
      Hernandez: You said you were in Capitol for about 20 mins?
      Aaron; Give or take, yeah

      Hernandez: You said you believed if you did something minor, you wouldn’t get in trouble?
      A: Could you rephrase?

      H: you said on direct you understand from your handler that when u were in these situations and if you did something minor, you wouldn’t get in trouble?
      A: If it kept me safe. I wasn’t told to explicitly be OK with doing minor things

      H: When you entered the capitol, you thought it was for something minor?
      Nick Smith for Nordean objects, speculation. Overruled.

      H: When you entered the Capitol, did u think it was something minor?
      A: i wasn’t thinking like that at the time, i was making sure that important things weren’t being destroyed

      10:21 AM Parloff:

      Carmen Hernandez (Rehl) is asking questions:
      H: you don’t know him?
      A: correct
      H: you were in capitol about 20 min?
      A: yes
      H: you believed that if you did something minor you wouldn’t get in trouble?
      A: if it kept me safe. i wasn’t told to explicitly be okay with doing minor things.
      H: and when you entered capitol you thought taht was something minor?
      Smith (Nordean): Objection
      A: no, i was thinking maybe i could prevent important things from being destroyed.
      Hernandez done. /47

      10 minute break.

    • harpie says:

      Here’s Capitol Hunters with info about Aaron [#TrackSuitPB]:

      10:07 AM · Mar 29, 2023

      In the Proud Boys trial, today’s witness is FBI informant #TrackSuitPB, who wore orange tape, moved with a group, and carried zip ties, but was so dim that he can likely claim he had no understanding of a violent plan without perjuring himself. (pic h/t @itisjustmebabe). [PHOTO] 1/

      • harpie says:

        Here’s a Ryan Reilly THREAD about the witness, #TrackSuitPB,
        which Brandi retweeted [includes videos]
        [Reilly calls him an FBI Antifa CHS]:
        2:10 PM · Mar 29, 2023

        #TrackSuitPB, who is going by “Ehren” on the stand, is testifying in the Proud Boys trial. Talking with his handler, he downplayed the PB’s role on Jan. 6.

        This is the guy the FBI was leaning on for intel on **checks notes**… antifa. Track suit guy. [THREAD]

        • harpie says:


          Infiltrating leftist groups is hard. Know what’s not hard? Sourcing up Proud Boy cosplayers who love cops (up until right before Jan. 6) and pretending like they’re going to have some sort of special insight on antifa.

    • harpie says:

      Cross by Mulroe

      10:43 AM Parloff:

      Nick Smith objects to certain chat messages that Mulroe wants to use on cross. Smith says he’s just seeing them now, doesn’t see why these weren’t shown to him yesterday. He says certain texts would expose his identity, also objects to political texts. …/50

      Mulroe: bias and credibility of witness is always relevant. I provided these upon conclusion of direct as is uniform practice in this case.
      One is a portion of the PB chat group this witness was in. One includes statement of Chris Kuehne about what he expects for J6 …

      Kuehne anticipates “violence so utterly massive that we send a message.”

      We think these bare on his credibility. Mr. Smith has put this witness forward as agent of the govt. one of his close associates who he spent whole day with on J6 was talking in these terms and he didn’t see fit to share these with the FBI.

      Smith is claiming these are outside the scope. …

      Judge is skeptical of Smith’s position.

      Smith: these are inflammatory remarks that not even the witness made–on theory that maybe he saw them & should have told FBI. /53

      Judge: he was a part of these chat groups. … they’re within a few days of J6. … “this is going to get kinetic quick.” his whole testimony was, ‘i was surprised.’ … someone he was closely associated with … dont know why that’s not fair?

      • harpie says:

        This is getting somewhat testy.

        11:00 AM Brandi:

        roots: if you rule these doors are wide open, then we could go deep deep with this stuff
        Mulroe: We have no problem with Mr. Pezzola’s counsel doing direct

        Smith: We are prepared to move to cross please.
        Kelly tries to see if other parties want to conduct cross and…

        Smith answers they would not. Kelly, voice raised, tells Smith he wants to hear from them, says something about being gracious.

        Smith: I understand the funny games the govt would like to play here, the defense has made a determination of the scope of this witness, its narrow. It’s about the march and no defense is suggesting we’re kicking the door open to further testimony…

        Roots raises his hand: Speaking for Pezzola, he wants a five minute consultation to speak with other lawyers so they can discus this

        Kelly says: I’ll give you 1 minute while the lawyers sit here

        Roots: After a little it of consultation, we’re going to waive direct
        Kelly: Let’s proceed.

    • harpie says:

      Maybe now, Cross by Mulroe begins.
      11:02 AM Brandi:

      AUSA Conor Mulroe begins his cross of Ethan Nordean’s witness, a CHS informant with first name Aaron
      Mulroe: You developed a relationship with FBI first in 2008?
      Smith objects, scope.
      Kelly: Mr. Mulroe —
      And sidebar. Husher on.

      Sidebar over
      Mulroe: 2008 sound aout right when you first started?
      Aaron: Yes
      M: 12 years before Jan 6?
      A: Yes
      M: That was about 8 years before Proud boys started?
      A: IDK when they started
      M: Quite a few years tho, you had this rltnship with FBI?
      A: Yes […]

      • harpie says:

        11:15 AM Brandi:

        Mulroe: You traveled to DC for a rally on 12/12?
        Smith objects, overruled.
        Aaron: Yes, i was already planning to go. They asked me if i was going with Proud Boys
        M: you let them know, and they didn’t ask you to do anything in partic?

        Aaron: they asked me to find out if a certain person would be there and what their motivations were
        Mulroe: they had nothing to do with proud boys?
        Correct, Aaron affirms, totally unrelated to PBs

      • harpie says:

        11:34 AM Brandi:

        Mulroe: Fair to say you had zero access to leadership?
        Aaron: Fair to say, yes
        Zero access to PBs who were in charge of planning or organizing for 1/6?

        11:34 AM Parloff:

        M: you had zero access to PB leadership?
        M: zero access to MOSD leaders?
        M: zero access to PBs planning for J6?
        correct /89

      • harpie says:

        After confirming Aaron was not in contact with national PB leadership that day:

        11:42 AM Brandi:

        Mulroe: As the group marched and chanted, the word revolution was on your mind?
        Yes, Aaron testifies, he hoped it wouldn’t turn into a color revolution that day. trump supporters were so angry. […]

        Mulroe: 2 days before the rally and you seeing those angry ppl, you used the phrase color revolution in chat?
        A: yeah, cus it was hopefully something stupid like that didn’t happen, after watching the spring revolution in egypt and orange revolution in ukraine… […]

        Mulroe: and this revolution would involve the national guard turning on left wing people?
        aaron: yeah something like that

        • harpie says:

          11:43 AM · Mar 29, 2023

          What if the Guard turned against the left, a Proud Boy witness said one day after Trump pitched just that.

          1/3/21 DOD IG:

          “Mr. Miller and GEN Milley met with the President at the White House at 5:30 p.m. The primary topic they discussed was unrelated to the scheduled rally. GEN Milley told us that at the end of the meeting, the President told Mr. Miller that there would be a large number of protestors on January 6, 2021, and Mr. Miller should ensure sufficient National Guard or Soldiers would be there to make sure it was a safe event. Gen Milley told us that Mr. Miller responded, ‘We’ve got a plan and we’ve got it covered.’” (IGp31)

      • harpie says:

        11:45 AM · Mar 29, 2023

        Mulroe pulls up this photo from inside Capitol.
        And asks Aaron about the man in camo pictured below: [PHOTO] [Pretty sure this is GIESWEIN]

        m: Once you joined up with rest of PBs, he wouldn’t be able to march in your ranks?
        a: Yes
        m: Thought he couldn’t march with you because he wasn’t a PB?
        a: Yes
        m: Turned out leaders were fine with him marching with you?
        a: I don’t know […]

        • harpie says:

          Marcy mentioned GIESWEIN here:
          November 25, 2022

          […] Based on that logic, the filing argues that the tactically important violence of a number of Proud Boys (plus Robert Geiswein, who is being prosecuted by Proud Boy prosecutor Erik Kenerson) was part of the conspiracy. […]

          Robert Gieswein, who is not a Proud Boy but who joined the marching group and wore orange masking tape as insignia showing affiliation with the marching group, sprayed officers with chemical irritant at multiple times and places inside the Capitol.

        • harpie says:

          11:43 Parloff:

          M: see guy with camo suit and baseball bat in hand?
          M: you recognize him?
          M: he approached you J6?
          he said are you a militia. he was all alone, could he walk with us.
          Mulroe elicits that Aaron thought he could hang for a bit but thought (incorrectly) he wouldn’t be allowed to march. (That’s Robert Gieswein.)

          M now showing excerpt from montage exhibit (12:46-12:48pm).
          M eliciting that a brother & sister from Arizona joined up the PBs. Billy Chrestman walks up to Rufio [Nordean] and taps him on shoulder & asks if he can march with them. 96

          • harpie says:


            Smith asks for sidebar and gets it.
            [Smith has been objecting pretty continuously all along, his voice expressing disbelief & contained outrage– “irrelevant” “beyond the scope” “403,” or “lack of foundation.”]

      • harpie says:

        11:45 AM Brandi:

        Mulroe: But leaders did have some control over who marched with you that day?
        Aaron: Yes […]

        11:53 AM Mulroe elicits that Geiswein was allowed to be back of PB marching group. He bumped into Geiswein later inside but didnt recall otherwise seeing him.

        Mulroe brings up a photo exhibit showing Aaron from 1/6. He’s got zip ties on his person.
        Mulroe: Zip ties used to restrain a person?
        A: Yeah, i’d never seen them before…
        He says he asked a guy for ibuprofen and the guy gave the zip ties to him and he said, “oh thanks”

        11:54 AM Parloff:

        Mulroe now talking about the walk from food trucks to Peace Monument.
        Mulroe now showing clip from that part of march.

        Mulroe showing Ryan Ashlock (goggles), Chris Kuehne (tan helmet), Billy Chrestman with ax handle in his hand. Another guy, Enrique Colon /101

      • harpie says:

        12:21 PM Parloff:

        M: but they started to?
        M: and those crowd control measures were so close to you that you felt the concussions, didn’t you.
        Smith: objection – scope, 403, relevance
        sidebar /120

        Mulroe: you were so close you could feel concussion against your legs?
        when they started using crowd control measures they started firing a device that projected them over the crowd into the middle area and it would cause people to part in the middle. and i was able to feel that concussion.

        M: you knew police were trying to get people to leave
        M: you knew people trying to stop what was going on inside?
        can’t recall
        M: you knew people were shouting stop the vote?
        i dont recall.
        M: you texted that to FBI? [showing him text]

        12:23 PM Brandi:

        Do you see police trying to restore order here? (in footage)
        Aaron: Yes
        Police hadn’t used crowd-control measures at this point yet but would start to?
        A: Yes
        Those measures were so close, you could feel the concussions in your legs?
        Objection. Sidebar. Husher

        Husher off.
        M: You were so close you could feel concussions against your legs?
        A: when they started using CCM, they began firing them, to my best recollection, projected from some device that went over crowd into middle area, causing ppl in circle to part, yes, i could feel it

        You knew very well at that point that ppl in crowd wanted to put a stop to what was going on in the bldg?
        Objection. Speculation. Overruled.
        A: I was not thinking of that at the time
        M; You heard ppl shouting stop the vote
        A: i don’t recall

      • harpie says:

        12:33 PM

        Mulroe is destroying this testimony, now showing the timelapse footage of the mob overtaking the west side of Cap allegedly led by Proud Boys. The timestamp when rioters arrive: 12:46. By 12:48, rioters spread out along line. Breach at 12:58

        By 1:02 p.m. [ET, when FBI received his message] crowd has consumed entire lower terrace.
        And this is when FBI agent got Aaron’s msg?
        Yes, he testifies, saying he sent it earlier ubt phone kept saying “sending” […]

        [He met with handler three times, and]

        Mulroe: And now on witness stand, more than 2 years after 1/6, now is the time you’re giving the explanation about how the msg was delayed?

        aaron: i had mentioned it to an agent back then (in august)

        Lunch break.

        • harpie says:

          12:33 PM Parloff:

          M: on 1/13/21 you met with FBI?
          M: you told them you sent it before you went thru 1st barrier?

          M: then april 2021 you met with them again? again you told them as soon as you saw crowd moving forward?
          yes. i was in shock. texted them.

          M: then august 2021 you met with FBI & lawyer & they pushed you on it?
          M: they pointed out time discrepancy?
          M: and you didn’t say anything that time about it taking time to send, right?

          M: so now more than 2 yrs later you’re saying it wouldn’t send.
          i mentioned it to the agent.

  7. harpie says:

    Transcript of 12/17/20 message forwarded to Deplorables51 = ALONSO
    7:37 AM · Mar 28, 2023 [screenshot]

    From 965418765 Deplorables51
    friend of mine sent me this.

    [18:24, 12/17/2020] Tim Moore: If there are plenty of affidavits signed and notarized under penalty of perjury in regards to the many lawsuits underway, there should be other counterclaim orders to expose the judicial corruption to justify a military tribunal to take charge of the SCOTUS traitors. [LINK]

    [18:24, 12/17/2020] Tim Moore: This just in …..
    Right now Trump is sitting on a stack of Trump cards or maybe Uno Wild Draw 4 (more years) that he just waiting to lay down like a fricking royal flush. He has court cases still pending that will go to the Supreme Court & thanks to TX case he now know how to file it under article 3 not 2 that will force them to hear it.

    He has the DNI report on Friday. Barr steps down 23rd (can now be a witness – – he did his job). Durham is a special counsel (can prosecute in any state). He’s letting civil, criminal, federal courts fail to handle the situation properly so he can use military tribunals. He has the data (all of it) from NSA, the Kraken supercomputer, the Alice supercomputer, (probably a couple others we haven’t heard about yet, too).

    He has dueling electors from 7 states legislatures. He has VP Pence as final arbiter of which ballots to accept. He has the insurrection act. The NDAA, the national emergency, the 14th amendment, the 2018 executive order, the 2017 very first EO, the Patriot Act, the FISA warrants, the Declassification of everything, people swear affidavits by the 1000, the QR code scan guy who just needs access to some real ballots & he can detect if they are fake by looking for creases & printing items using his scanner technology, he has all the statistical data being analyzed, the videos, emails, phone calls, bank transfer statements showing the coordination of the coup, he has RICO, he has the crimes against humanity videos, Wikileaks just dropped a ton and Assange will be pardoned so he can talk about Seth Rich.

    Now that the governors and secretary of states certified & Biden accepted, they committed and knowingly agreed to treason. Solar Winds just raided & Dominion closing up shop. Same with politicians & media. He has the C_A servers used to change dominion machines, he will soon have access to the machines too. He baited them to staying in DC so they can be inaugurated, oops arrested.

    Biden hasn’t accepted any transition money nor has Kamala given up her seat. The military has infiltrated Antifa & BLM & he has the financials. He knows which politicians took Chinese & Soros money. He put in Miller & Watnick. He also just reduced dumb regulations. And [last half line missing from screenshot]

    • harpie says:

      1:53 PM Parloff:

      [re: documents Hernandez wants to admit]
      Judge: they’re out. … you can’t articulate a basis for relevance.
      H: it’s not fair–
      Judge: Ms. Hernandez, I’m talking. i’ve indulged a lot of talking over me but i’m not going to permit it. [if you can come up …/134

      1:54 PM Brandi:

      Kelly: The underlying documents are out, you haven’t articulated a theory of relevance to the case.
      Hernandez: I object and I object to being done in the middle of trial… the govt doesn’t give you a reason, they just say they don’t want them in…

      Hernandez (for Rehl) says this impacts 6A rights
      Kelly says again, she hasn’t articulated basis for relevance and that is her duty as party offering evidence. So he will exclude non permit portion of doc.

      But Judge Kelly says if between now and when her witness takes the stand and she has basis for relevance, he’ll accept, he’ll hear her then.
      H: it violates my client’s 6a rights….

      Kelly: I dont think it violates your client’s 6a rights to ask you to articulate the relevance
      Hernandez: When I came in from lunch…
      Kelly: I’m not asking to hear from you anymore
      Hernandez: I’d like to put on the record…
      K: You’re not hearing me, return to your seat (3x)

    • harpie says:

      2:06 PM Brandi:

      Dan Hull and Norm Pattis – both for defendant Joe Biggs – are having what appears to be a rather intense conversation as we wait with Hull doing most of the talking from my vantage.

      And the jury enters.

      2:14 PM Brandi:

      Did Aaron think he was “making history?” in the moment?
      Aaron says he doesn’t recall thinking that in the moment.
      Mulroe now brings up an exhibit for Aaron to review and refresh his memory.

      Smith objects on history of relevance.

      Mulroe reads exhibit: “Anyone who does that to the capitol has literally made history.
      That’s what you believed isn’t it, Mulroe asks.
      A: if its there, then that’s what i thought at the time

      M: you compared what was going on at capitol to the civil rights movement
      A: we still hear about it today, just like the challenger explosion, its history

    • harpie says:

      2:28 PM Brandi:

      Mulroe: And you thought you and guys would stop people…
      Aaron: from damaging it yes
      M: You understood police were forcibly trying to remove rioters from bldg?
      A: yes, it looked like they had lost control
      M: Understood there were far more rioters than police?
      A: Yes

      Mulroe: You understood by going in that bldg, you were going to make things worse?
      Aaron: Not by acting disrespectfully […]
      Mulroe: Your testimony is you saw these officers lined up in riot gear shoulder to shoulder, what you thought would help is if you & Chris could get in and help people out?
      A: no
      M: your feet weren’t hurting anymore?
      Obj. Overruled
      A: i had ibuprofen, was feeling a little better

      2:29 PM Parloff:

      [playing video:]
      M: saw yourself and Chris walk by on Upper West Terrace shortly before you went inside?
      a little while before we went inside.
      [video: shows line of riot police facing off with rioters on terrace.]
      Smith: objection relevance, cumulative, waste of time

      M: officers have on gas masks?
      M: batons?
      M: crowd chanting “you’re on the wrong side.”
      M: you & chris walked right past those officers?
      M: you decided that what would help was if you and chris entered bldg?

    • harpie says:


      Sidebar, husher on and off within a minute or two.
      Then Mulroe puts on screen the text Aaron sent to his handler.
      It was up and gone on screen fast. But I caught:
      we entered 30 minus after it breached told people to stop acting like anarchists… “,

      Now Mulroe plays footage from Capitol interior. It’s at senate wing doors as windows break, wood comes flying through window. And another clip. It shows Aaron coming through door at 2:25

      M: So, 12 minutes. Not 30 minutes (As he said to FBI)
      A: Yes

      2:36 PM Parloff:

      M showing message you sent FBI on afternoon of J6:
      “we entered bldg 30 min after breached.”

      Now M showing CCTV footage from 2:13pm inside Senate Wing Doors … window breaks. board comes thru … /156

      Now showing Aaron coming thru door at 2:25pm
      M: so that’s about 12 minutes, not 30 min?
      M: see you filming there with your phone?
      M: you didn’t give that to FBI did you?
      don’t recall doing so

    • harpie says:


      2:43 PM Brandi:

      M: You didn’t give that video to the FBI did you?
      A: Dont recall.
      M: Didnt see fit to mention that people had smashed windows?
      Aaron says he didn’t think about it
      M: As you moved from place to place you saw police retreating?

      m: That was your word, retreat?
      He can’t recall, “might have been”
      m: You also used the word fleeing?
      a: its possible

      He shows him where he uses fleeing in prior stmt.
      Police were vastly outnumbered?

      Aaron says yes, “that’s a fair assessment” when Mulroe says police were fleeing because crowd followed them wherever they moved bbabck

      2:48 PM Mulroe: People on far side are trying to slide furniture underneath it? [the gate]
      A: Yes
      M: Agree police are trying to clear those obstructions out of way?
      A: Uh, yes
      (Footage plays, see a rioter throw a large object hard like a trash can and hit officer)

      2:47 PM Parloff:

      M: police are trying to push down that gate?
      M: you’d agree with me that police wanted that gate closed?
      objection overruled
      yes. i wasn’t considering that when i put my hands on that man’s shoulder.
      objection overruled
      M: gate wouldve kept officers safer? /163

      i see the police wanted it down.
      M: focus your attention on left side of screen. You and Chris moved chair aside and put a larger podium in path of gate?
      A: i was being instructed to do that?
      M: by FBI?
      A: no, but chris. Gate was already blocked at that time.

      M: did FBI tell you to put that podium under the gate?
      M: you and another PB put that podium under the gate?
      M: then you went past that gate to a lower level of the capitol?
      M: you thought there was an entrance to the House there?
      yes, i may be wrong

      • RipNoLonger says:

        Harpie – you are absolutely amazing. I’m not sure how this works for you, but you give all of us an incredible benefit by transcribing these in near real-time.

        • harpie says:

          Thank you, Rip! It’s really Brandi and Roger doing the hard work…I’m just copy/pasting and trying to organize it. But I’m really glad that it’s interesting to you and others. I find it very riveting, and am so glad to be able to follow the proceedings…I feel like I’m learning a great deal. And THANK YOU to Marcy and crew for maintaining this site and comment system, so I can share.

    • harpie says:

      3:00 PM Brandi:

      Mulroe: There came a time when people speculated you may have been an informant for FBI?
      A: Yes.
      M: Hard for you isn’t it?
      A: Yes
      M: There are plenty of people out there who don’t want you to be a CHS?
      A: Yes

      Mulroe: You never wanted to hurt the Proud Boys did you?
      Aaron hesitates at first. Then testifies: “I didn’t want – if someone was innocent of something they were accused of and I had information that could help, I’d help, if not, i wouldn’t…

      Aaron cont.: Like, with certain things that one of them openly said to me, I didn’t know about those facts at the time, but afterwards, I had no choice but to report it when asked.”

      Cross is done.

    • harpie says:

      3:07 PM Brandi:

      Did you lie to the FBI when you sent this msg?

      Jurors see Aaron’s “herd mentality” text

      No, Aaron testifies.

      Aaron continues: It’s what I witnessed and believed to be true. I may have misunderstood the situation but I believed it then.

      Smith asks about the timestamps text from 12:02 CT and Aaron affirms, he’s telling the truth about the time he sent it. He claims it was during first breach.
      Smith: Have agents you’ve ever worked with called you a liar?
      Objections. Overruled
      A: No

      Did agents suggest this (text) was a lie?
      Objection relevance. Overruled.

      I should have been a little more articulate at the time —
      Did you or did you not mean the initial push over barriers was spontaneous?
      A: From my perspective, it appeared that way

    • harpie says:

      3:29 PM Brandi:

      S: Were you able to see and hear what the leaders said along the march on the way?
      a: For the most part yes
      S: And that’s why you testified you didn’t understand reason marching, walking toward the Capitol building?
      A: Yes

      Aaron adds a moment later (I didn’t catch the question):
      A: That’s why I was concerned we would be walked before we were tired before we could make sure people got back to their hotels safely that night from the rally

      And that ends Nick Smith’s redirect of the witness.
      We’re taking our afternoon break before we finish out the day.

      3:28 PM Parloff:

      S: were you able to observe, see and hear what leaders of marching group were doing while marching?
      for most part.
      S: and that’s your basis for saying you don’t think the purpose was to invade capitol?

      S: and that’s why you don’t think purpose was to interfere with police officers?
      yes. that’s why i was concerned we walked till we were tired. I assumed we’d be marching with [respect to] Antifa later — defensively.

      Smith is done.



      Judge: I encourage counsel to talk to each other about this during the break. [Sounds like some defendant wants to ask an additional question of the witness in light of something that Smith brought out on redirect.]

      Now giving everyone a 10-minute break.

    • harpie says:

      3:50 PM Brandi:

      Judge Kelly is back on the bench and immediately we go to a sidebar.

      I want you to know, I hear this husher sound in my dreams.

      Thank you for all your hard work, Brandi!

      It appears that Hernandez wants to direct the witness about videos from cross. Roots does too.

      Roots: prosecutor asked Mulroe, after 3rd time of mtg with fbi, ‘fbi pushed you kind of hard didn’t they?’ that was to get witness to change his story…
      kelly: that can be your interpretation…

      Roots thinks a stronger pt should be made about Geiswein. He argues govt made him out to be scarier than necessary etc. Kelly says, well, the individual (Geiswein) said can I join and witness said, IDK, you’ll have to go to the back…

    • harpie says:

      4:03 PM Brandi:

      After some brief back and forth with Hernandez, we’re getting back to business now.
      The witness is back on the stand.

      Hernandez will conduct redirect of Aaron now.
      H: Before govt started asking you questions about Rehl – you didn’t know him, but govt showed u a number of videos. Your testimony is still you didn’t recognize Rehl in any of those videos?

      Aaron looks toward back of court, Hernandez IDs him as Aaron says “um” and she moves on – did he see Rehl attack or impede officers, direct anyone else to?
      Aaron says no.

      Roger Roots for Dominic Pezzola is now conducting redirect of Aaron.
      He brings up picture below.
      Roots: Would you agree with me that the scariest guy in the picture is this guy right here with club in his hand?
      Objection, leading relevance. Sustained.

      4:04 PM Parloff:

      Carmen Hernandez (Rehl) doing redirect of “Aaron.”
      H: you still didn’t recognize Rehl in any of additional videos Mulroe showed?
      H: did you see Rehl knocking over fences or throwing things at police officers?

      Roger Roots (Pezzola) doing “redirect” [without direct]
      Showing this photo again.
      R: remember looking at that?
      R: agree with me that this guy [Gieswein] over here is scariest guy in the picture?
      R: in your opinion whose scariest looking guy?
      R: so it was you, an fbi informant, who got him into the PB march?

      objection – misstates.
      R: was it thru you that he was able to get into the march that day?
      good question. He didn’t listen very well about staying back once we met up with other PBs.
      Roots is done.

    • harpie says:

      4:11 PM Brandi:

      Now, Judge Kelly gives instruction about Fernando Alonso’s testimony.

      Kelly: You heard testimony about Fernando Alonso’s communication discussing potential violence on 1/6. Our law regards mere abstract calls for violence on some future date as protected or permissible under 1A

      Kelly: Its for you to determine whether that speech reflects intentions, plans, and state of mind of Mr. Alonso and not of the defendants.

  8. harpie says:


    4:11 PM · Mar 29, 2023

    Now. we move onto witnesses for the defense for Proud Boy Zachary Rehl.

    There was a brief sidebar before Hernandez begins.
    The witness is sworn in.
    USCP Sergeant Blane Endale, with Capitol police for since 2003; she’s a sergeant in special events section.
    in this section since 2017.

    4:14 PM Parloff:

    Carmen Hernandez now calls Zach Rehl’s first witness (defense team’s 7th witness).
    Blane Endale [woman]
    US Capitol Police officer
    since 2003
    special events
    been with that section since 2017
    I oversee special events requests /206

    • harpie says:

      4:29 PM Brandi:

      Where does the form go after you get all the information?
      You asking about this form or the file? …. Once file has been completed and w/in regulations then file gets moved up thru the process

      Hernandez: when you say file, do you know what kind of forms?
      En: their application, any notes taken by coordinator, to include a 303 and 1563 (the permit) and an internal doc and any notes re; conversations as I stated previously

      Hernandez: does that include what is referred to as a special attention memorandum?
      Prosecutor Nadia Moore: objection, relevance.
      Judge Kelly: Ms. Hernandez, I’ll hear you at sidebar.

      4:34 PM Brandi:

      Hernandez: I want to go to Jan. 6, if we could… are you familiar with permits issued on 1/6 for demonstrations at US Capitol?
      Endale: I am.
      H: Do you know them off top of your head?
      E: I believe i do but please tell me which ones you’re talking about

      How many demonstration permits were granted for 5th, 6th?
      For 5th, Sergeant Endale can’t recall off top of her head, but for the 6th, she says there were six.

      • harpie says:

        4:35 PM Parloff:

        H: in total how many were granted for J5?
        don’t recall

        H: for J6?
        there were 6.
        H: first was request by person or organization Brian Lewis.
        [showing the exhibit]

        [It’s actually *Bryan* Lewis.]
        between 8:30am-5pm
        grassy area 9
        claims they’ll have 50 people. hand-held signs, placards. one bullhorn. no marshals will be utilized. not requesting electrical power.

        4:38 PM Brandi:

        Hernandez points to permit from a Bryan Lewis.

        This, I’m fairly certain, is the former Trump WH aide.

        It’s a permit for 8:30 a.m. to 5 p.m. on 1/6 for “grassy area no. 9”
        That’s 1 of the areas we saw on the [demonstration aerial] map?
        Endale: I believe so

        Area #9 is at the North East corner of the Capitol
        [North is to the left on the map.]
        4:39 PM Brandi:

        For another permit, filed by group, Jesus Lives, they were given permit for west front grassy area 1 and union square area 15 for 5th and 6th respectively, number of participants listed are 50.
        This permit was authorized on 1/5.
        Was scaffolding already up?

        • harpie says:

          4:41 PM Parloff:

          Second permit:
          organization: Jesus Lives
          Tues J5: grassy area 1 (within what would be restricted zone on J6 on west front)

          Wed J6: Area 15. (over by reflecting pool near 3d street NW. outside restricted zone).
          banner, stage, podium, solar generator, solar panels, sound /221

    • harpie says:

      4:46 PM Parloff:

      Third permit:
      organization: One Nation Under God
      Grassy Area 8: [off map we’re looking at toward northeast of Capitol.]
      H: this group confirmed that some congress people would be present? [first name], Andy Biggs–
      AUSA Moore: objection

      4:47 PM Brandi:

      Now, another permit for One Nation Under God (Ali Alexander) is being reviewed. It indicates they were going to have congressmen coming, Andy Biggs is namedropped… DOJ objects. Husher on.

      Oldie but goodie thread from Jason Leopold: [link]

      Links to:
      12:35 PM · Sep 10, 2021

      Capitol Police green lit a permit to a non existent group called One Nation Under God (linked to Stop the Steal & Ali Alexander) to protest on Capitol grounds Jan 6. One Nation Under God said Reps Brooks & Biggs were confirmed speakers. Here are others [screenshots][THREAD]

    • harpie says:

      4:52 PM Brandi:

      Hernandez wants to show Endale the document that goes along with One Nation Under God app
      Nadia Moore for DOJ objects, improper refreshment.
      Sidebar. Husher on.

      Husher off.
      On One Nation Under God Permit – did it say purpose of event?
      Moore: Objection, relevance hearsay.
      Kelly: All right, so here we go.
      Sidebar. Husher on.

      Husher off.
      Hernandez: do you recall whether this One Nation Under God permit related to a demonstration for election fraud in swing states?
      Endale: I don’t recall
      Hernandez: If i show you CP303, would that reflect your recollection
      E: Yes

      It says “demonstration for election fraud in swing states” Endale testifies, reviewing the application.
      H: That corresponds to permit given to that entity by USCP?
      Endale: Correct

      Objection to moving it into evidence. Sustained.

      H: Are you familiar with a form ( I didn’t catch name of it)
      Objection. Sustained.

      • harpie says:

        4:56 PM Parloff:

        [by the way, the first congressman Hernandez mentioned who’d be attending this one was Mo Brooks, in addition to Andy Biggs.]

    • harpie says:

      5:01 PM Brandi:

      Another permit for Jan. 6 from Women for a Great America.
      Endale affirms what Hernandez is reading is correct.
      Grassy area 10.
      Endale is asked to show where it is on map, but its not on the demonstrative because its beyond the bounds of the aerial map here behind here

      Hernandez asks if on Women for a Great America app, these people were able to bring speakers, batteries, scheduled for Jan 5 thru Jan 10?
      Endale affirms.

      Area 10 is at the South East corner of the Capitol.

    • harpie says:

      5:05 PM Parloff:

      Hernandez done.

      Roger Roots (Pezzola) will do direct:

      R: were these events capped in terms of attendance?
      yes. 50 per location. 50 per event
      R: is there any enforcement for that?
      they’re advised of that when they coordinate with us.
      R: any penalties if 51 people show up?
      could be /230

      5:07 PM Brandi:

      Roots: These events didn’t specify that they’d be cordoned off did they?
      Endale is having trouble hearing him
      Roots: Let’s say event at grassy area, there’s an event permitted there, do they cordon off and fence off the place, the event?
      Endale: Who?

      Roots: Organizers, like women for great America
      Roots: so public could wander in, generally?
      endale: they could. it’s an open area
      Roots: Would ppl attending Trump speech want to attend more than 1 of these permitted events?
      Objection. Sustained.

      Roots: On Jan 6 with so many permitted events, it would be expected that people might move from one event to another, wouldn’t they?
      Objection. Speculation.
      Endale: I can’t speak to that–
      Sustained as to speculation.

      • harpie says:

        5:11 PM Brandi:

        Roots: Ppl who will speak or attend these events – would you say — at least one was an anti-Trump event?
        Endale: Unless I see the information, I don’t recall which is which, they were all 1A activities in my eyes

        Roots: Would ppl be walking thru the Capitol to get from 1 event to another?
        Endale: Going in? We’re talking about inside or outside?
        Roots tries to reframe but stops himself and ends his questioning.

    • harpie says:


      5:12 PM

      Nadia Moore now redirects Sergeant Endale.

      Moore pulls up the USCP Grounds Demonstration Areas Map. Sections are broken up and color coded. Red areas are where NO demonstrations are permitted. The Capitol Building is red.

      Yellow areas are for areas that cant be impeded at any time.
      Green areas are permissible.
      But on 1/6, not all areas were available for demonstrations, Endale affirms.
      Area 1 not available? Correct (lower grassy area)

      Moore: Looking back to Rehl exhibit areas 7, 8, 9, 10, 11 and 15 were only areas available for demonstrations?
      Endale: That is correct

      Moore asks Endale if on application for permit it says: the volume of any sound from a demonstration has to be kept to minimum and directed away from congressional office bldgs?
      That is correct, Endale says.

      Moore notes on permit app, it says weapons are not permitted.
      Hernandez objects, scope. Overruled.
      That is correct.

      Moore looking at Pennsylvania walkway on map- are demonstrators allowed to demonstrate on sidewalk?
      Endale: Yes, where’s there no restrictions and they’re not impeding walkways
      Moore: They’d need a permit though?
      E: Yes
      M: No such permits in this area for 1/6?
      E: No

      Moore: In fact Area 1 was completely closed on 1/6?
      Objection foundation
      That is correct, Area 1 – everything is closed (for 1/6), Endale says, including areas in Area 1 that were marked yellow (non impede areas)

      Now Moore pulls up a video.
      Hernandez is objecting to scope. Sidebar, husher on.

      • harpie says:

        5:20 PM Brandi:

        The video pulled up and left on screen for jury right now is timestamped 12:55-12:56 p.m. and Joe Biggs is visible, and saying – according to video transcript – “What the fuck. Oh my god this is such history woohooo”

        Moore: Looking back at this, did this appear to depict a march?
        Endale: Definitely
        And there were no permits for marches on jan 6?
        And fair to say there’s more than 50 people here?
        And permits were limited to 50 people/
        Hernandez objects. Overruled.

        Defendant Joe Biggs is heard on video now for jurors, walking through what Endale just said is an impeded area, or a restricted area.

        Biggs on tape:
        “We’ve gone through every barricade so far. Fuck you!”


        More than 50 people here? Fair to say?
        This wouldn’t have been allowed even if there wasn’t a permit for this area, correct?
        Endale: Correct
        And this area is also impeded at this point?
        Which is also prohibited based on color coded map from Rehl exhibit?

        Hernandez objects. Overruled.
        Now we see video from top of terrace on west front of Capitol.


      • harpie says:

        5:24 PM Brandi:

        Hernandez objects to video being played.
        Kelly asks to see counsel at sidebar.

        Husher on and off within a few moments.
        Next area shown now to jurors, where window is being bashed open on west side. It’s in the no-go red zone, where demonstrations are never permitted.

        Is breaking Capitol property ever permitted
        Objection. Sustained.

        Husher on and off within a few moments.
        Next area shown now to jurors, where window is being bashed open on west side. It’s in the no-go red zone, where demonstrations are never permitted.

      • harpie says:


        5:30 PM Brandi:

        […] Hernandez elicits that Endale originally declined a request from Hernandez for her testimony.
        Did she meet with prosecutors before testifying today?
        Endale: For a brief moment

        Hernandez: There were many more demonstrations slated for 1/6 in and around DC?
        Endale: I don’t know

        Hernandez: Were you aware Trump was having a rally on the Ellipse?
        Endale affirms.
        Did she know there would be lots and lots of people – “huge” numbers as the former president would have said –
        Endale: I don’t know but number were large

        Hernandez asks if people tend to congregate around monuments for large demonstrations. Objection Sustained.

        5:33 PM Brandi:

        Hernandez: You said yellow areas show areas that are not supposed to be impeded
        Endale: Correct
        Hernandez: So you can walk in these areas
        Endale: You can
        (We’ve already established, this wasn’t the case on Jan. 6.)

        Endale: I know there were other events around Capitol (not on grounds) but I don’t know who they were or what they were [doing]. I just know about whats happening on Capitol grounds.

        Sidebar. Husher on.

        • harpie says:

          5:36 PM Brandi:

          Husher off.
          Hernandez: Originally, we spoke about 1 of the rallies was for Bryan Lewis. Remember?
          Endale: yes
          h: purpose for lewis event was to urge congress to nullify votes from states who made illegal changes to voting rules for elections?
          Obj. relevance/scope. Overruled

          Endale: If it says that, then yes
          Hernandez; Then let me show you —
          Kelly: Can i have counsel at sidebar?
          Husher on.

          Husher off.
          Hernandez says she knows jury has plans for tomorrow, so “let me stop.”
          Kelly excuses the jury for the day.

          I’m not super clear on whether or not Endale will be required to return tomorrow.

        • harpie says:

          5:42 PM Brandi:

          Kelly: Maybe parties can work out stipulation if there’s some additional testimony given the witnesses’ schedule.

          Kelly: Anything parties want to raise before 9 a.m? tomorrow? Who are next witnesses for tomorrow? I think I know 2 of them. Is there a third on tap?

          5:43 PM Right now, Hernandez is saying she thinks things are unfair and says court’s view of scope hasn’t been fairly applied. “It’s ridiculous they’re allowed to play these videos over and over again…” “Sorry for calling it ridiculous”

          Things are unfair, Hernandez argues, because the govt shouldn’t be able to object after she’s prepared examination based on records she thought would be admitted.

          Thank You Brandi! Good Night!

          5:42 PM Parloff:

          H: I have two more after Jeff Finley and Ms Rehl. I’d like to put Finley on first. Then Henry McGill or Mr. Guffrey and then Ms. Rehl, but I’m not sure of that order.

          Very unfair of govt to object after i’ve prepared an examination based on records I thought would come in. /255

          Hernandez is still protesting the unfairness of keeping out her permit backup records and claims Judge is more lenient with govt than defense on scope issues.
          “From this end it does not look that there’s fair play.”

          Judge: “Sorry you feel that way. See you all at 9am tomorrow.”

          Likewise, I hope! /257-end

          • timbozone says:

            Thanks, Harpie, for putting all these posts here. For some reason, I couldn’t find Brandi’s second half of the day easily on twitter. Much easier to read here than on twitter. Also, Parloff’s take is good to have for cross ref.

  9. harpie says:

    Today’s THREADs

    5:57 AM · Mar 30, 2023

    It is Day 47 of the Proud Boys seditious conspiracy trial. Live coverage from the courthouse starts at 9 am ET. Testimony is expected from witnesses for defendant Zachary Rehl. If things go according to plan, the jury will hear from jailbound West Va. PB prez Jeff Finley today.

    8:10 AM · Mar 30, 2023

    It’s Mar. 30 and Day 47 of the Proud Boys trial. I’ll be live-tweeting here and on Lawfare: [link]. Def Zach Rehl may call as his 2d witness WV PB Jeff Finley today. (Finley below on J6, without & with gaiter.) /1 [PHOTOS]

    Parloff has a recap today, Brandi does not.

    • harpie says:

      9:32 AM Brandi:

      The charging decision of a tool – I haven’t let that in regarding any tool, Kelly says.

      Hernandez argues the plea ag ‘may not be dispositive, but its relevant”. And to extent govt should disclude it is if its unduly prejudicial

      The govt has smeared her client, Hernandez says, there’s no proof of Rehl being violent.

      Kelly interrupts her and says he’s heard her on this but its 9:28 (jury is waiting) and shes still not made a relevance argument. So he’s going to exclude it.

      Kelly says the govt will be able to show Finley his own conduct and say ‘did you do this or that’ and as court did with defendant’s last witness,there will be objections and limits set on a case by case basis

    • harpie says:

      They’re working on scheduling for the rest of the trial.

      9:44 AM Brandi:

      There’s a light at the end of this tunnel. It’s about the size of a pinhead but I can still see it.

      Hang in there, Brandi!

  10. harpie says:

    WITNESS: Amanda REHL
    9:48 AM Brandi:

    The jury has entered and the first witness today will be the wife of defendant Zachary Rehl: Amanda Rehl.
    She has black glasses, long blonde hair and when asked if she’s nervous by Carmen Hernandez she chuckles lightly, nervously and says yes.

    9:49 AM Parloff:

    Hernandez (Rehl) calls 2d witness, defense team’s 8th.
    Amanda Rehl
    married to Zachary Rehl
    born Philadelphia
    Archbishop Ryan school
    Community College Philadelphia
    Associate’s degree in business
    stay-at-home mom to their child

  11. harpie says:

    Witness: Amanda REHL; cross

    10:00 AM Brandi:

    Now we move to cross by AUSA Erik Kenerson.
    He tells her he will keep it short for her today.
    Kenerson: Rehl joined PBs in 2018, right?
    Amanda: yes
    K: he was pretty invested in group?
    a: i would say so yes
    k: he eventually became president of Philly chapter?
    a: yes

  12. harpie says:

    I have some comments in moderation…which makes it difficult to put things in order… I might continue when they get through, but maybe this is the universe reminding me I have other things I need to do today. I’ll catch up later. :-)

        • bmaz says:

          I had jury duty this morning, which is why I was asleep at the proverbial wheel. Took them an entire 30 minutes to figure out I would never be seated as a juror.

          • harpie says:

            That’s too bad, because I know you’d like to sit on a jury, but never will be able to. You’d think there would be a waiver you could fill out before having to go through that!
            [Do you think you might be able to after you retire?]

  13. harpie says:

    Here are the THREADS for 3/31/23:
    5:23 AM · Mar 31, 2023

    It is Day 48 of the Proud Boys seditious conspiracy trial and the end to a very long and very tough week for the defendants as their witnesses have withered under cross. My live coverage begins at 9 am ET for @emptywheel. I hope you will join me.

    7:54 AM · Mar 31, 2023

    It’s Mar. 31 and Day 48 of the Proud Boys trial. I’ll be live-tweeting here and on Lawfare: [LINK]. We might or might not get another witness for def Zach Rehl today. Then we’ll begin def Joe Biggs’ case. /1

    [ARRRRGGG!!! I did the same thing as yesterday and forgot that Parloff always has a link in his first tweet > my comment in pokey.]

    Brandi has already wondered if/how the SDNY indictment of TRUMP might effect this PB trial.

    Also, comments on this post will probably close sometime today. If that happens, I’ll continue on this post, since there are few comments there and it will give me an extra day: “THAT’S HOW … YOU END UP AS A DEFENDANT IN A COURT ROOM:” SOME DAYS IN THE LIFE OF A NAMED-AND-SHAMED FORMER GRU HACKER, IVAN ERMAKOV

    • harpie says:

      Another ill juror:

      9:08 AM Brandi:

      Kelly: We got this information too late to stop the jury from coming in but i didn’t turn them around on theory I’d speak with you first, but given today is a half day and we’re only losing 2.5 hours, I wanted to take the chance of not dismissing the juror and consult with you all.

      All of the parties are now huddled in the courtroom at their respective tables. […]

      9:14 AM The jury will be released for the day. 5 minute recess. When we return, we’ll go through some of the lingering motions.

  14. harpie says:

    Here are the THREADS for 3/31/23:

    5:23 AM · Mar 31, 2023

    It is Day 48 of the Proud Boys seditious conspiracy trial and the end to a very long and very tough week for the defendants as their witnesses have withered under cross. My live coverage begins at 9 am ET for @emptywheel. I hope you will join me.

    7:54 AM · Mar 31, 2023

    It’s Mar. 31 and Day 48 of the Proud Boys trial. I’ll be live-tweeting here and on Lawfare: [LINK]. We might or might not get another witness for def Zach Rehl today. Then we’ll begin def Joe Biggs’ case. /1

    Brandi has already wondered if/how the SDNY indictment of might effect this PB trial.

    Also, comments on this post will probably close sometime today. If that happens, I’ll continue on this post, since there are few comments there and it will give me an extra day: “THAT’S HOW … YOU END UP AS A DEFENDANT IN A COURT ROOM:” SOME DAYS IN THE LIFE OF A NAMED-AND-SHAMED FORMER GRU HACKER, IVAN ERMAKOV

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