It’s Still Not Clear Whether Elon’s DOGE Boys Are Reviewing, Taking, or Altering Government Networks
The big news overnight in the legal fight to rein in DOGE is that SDNY Judge Paul Engelmayer has ordered Treasury to stop letting Elon Musk’s DOGE [sic] boys to snoop in Treasury’s payment system and destroy any copies of records already made from it. [docket]
the defendants are (i) restrained from granting access to any Treasury Department payment record, payment systems, or any other data systems maintained by the Treasury Department containing personally identifiable information and/or confidential financial information of payees, other than to civil servants with a need for access to perform their job duties within the Bureau of Fiscal Services who have passed all background checks and security clearances and taken all information security training called for in federal statutes and Treasury Department regulations; (ii) restrained from granting access to all political appointees, special government employees, and government employees detailed from an agency outside the Treasury Department, to any Treasury Department payment record, payment systems, or any other data systems maintained by the Treasury Department containing personally identifiable information and/or confidential financial information of payees; and (iii) ordered to direct any person prohibited above from having access to such information, records and systems but who has had access to such information, records, and systems since January 20, 2025, to immediately destroy any and all copies of material downloaded from the Treasury Department’s records and systems, if any;
This order comes on top of Judge Colleen Kollar-Kotelly’s order limiting access to Treasury’s payment system to normal employees and two DOGE [sic] employees, but the latter for read-only access [docket]:
Mr. Tom Krause, a Special Government Employee in the Department of the Treasury, as needed for the performance of his duties, provided that such access to payment records will be “read only”;
Mr. Marko Elez, a Special Government Employee in the Department of the Treasury, as needed for the performance of his duties, provided that such access to payment records will be “read only”;
Anna Bower parsed how DOJ substantiated (or not) that this was really “read only” access. Which was part of what a bunch of Democratic Attorneys General, led by Tish James, pointed to to claim they still needed a TRO, over and above the one issued by Kollar-Kotelly.
The temporary restraining order entered yesterday by the D.C. District Court in Alliance for Retired Americans v. Bessent, No. 1:25-cv-313 (D.D.C.) (“ARA”), does not change this conclusion. That order continues to permit two SGEs affiliated with DOGE to have access to the BFS payment records and payment systems, restricts their access to “read only” just for payment records and not payment systems, and does not direct that any copies of data from the systems made since the Agency Action took effect be destroyed. ARA, Dkt No. 13.
Now, I’m somewhat skeptical that Engelmeyer’s order, as issued, is sustainable. He issued the order in advance of the assigned judge on the case, Jeannette Vargas, and before the government had a chance to respond to the lawsuit.
But the lawsuits to enjoin DOGE [sic] are playing catch-up to the known facts.
And the known facts get us much closer to the being able to prove that Elon and his DOGE [sic] boys are altering code, if not hacking it, rather than simply reviewing its data.
The suit and TRO before Judge Kollar-Kotelly, filed by several unions, is entirely privacy focused.
The state AGs’ suit and TRO, which establish standing by pointing to the billions of dollars of payments they get from the Feds, argues that Elon is attempting to intercept payments to entities Trump doesn’t like. It asserts a claim repeatedly backed in public reporting, but affirmatively denied before Kollar-Kotelly: that the DOGE boys — here, self-proclaimed eugenicist Mark Elez, have altered code.
5. As of February 2, 2025, the President and Treasury Secretary, directed Treasury to grant expanded access to BFS payment systems to political appointees and “special government employees” for reasons that have yet to be provided, although one apparent purpose, upon information and belief. Upon information and belief, one purpose is to allow DOGE to advance a stated goal to block federal funds from reaching beneficiaries who do not align with the President’s political agenda. For example, DOGE was tasked with freezing payments issued by the U.S. Agency for International Development (“USAID”) and sought access to BFS payment systems to accomplish that goal.5 Virtually unfettered access to BFS payment systems was granted to at least one 25-year-old DOGE associate, Mark Elez, who, on information and belief, had the authority to view or modify numerous critical files.6 Indeed, reports indicate that Elez had administrative privileges over the BFS payment system’s code, giving him the ability to alter user permissions and “read and write” code—even if the associate had “read-only” access to the system’s data.7 Elez has since resigned from DOGE after being linked to racist social media posts.8
6. Around the same time that DOGE associates were unlawfully granted access to BFS systems, Mr. Musk began publicly stating his intention to recklessly freeze streams of federal funding without warning. On February 2, 2024, Mr. Musk posted on X (formerly Twitter), an online social media platform, that DOGE is “rapidly shutting down” various “illegal payments” made by the government to grant recipients, including payments to Lutheran Family Services to provide services to migrant children.9 That same day, Mr. Musk posted that his team “spent the weekend feeding USAID into the wood chipper.” Since then, Mr. Musk has unambiguously called for the cancellation of various streams of federal funding. For instance, on February 6, 2025, he alleged: “Billions of taxpayer dollars to known FRAUDULENT entities are STILL being APPROVED by Treasury. This needs to STOP NOW!”10 Mr. Musk has also made wild, unsubstantiated claims about the BFS payment system and suggested putting it on the blockchain.11
6 A 25-Year-Old With Elon Musk Ties Has Direct Access to the Federal Payment System | WIRED
7 https://www.wired.com/story/elon-musk-associate-bfs-federal-payment-system/
8 DOGE Staffer Resigns Over Racist Posts
9 Elon Musk on X: “The @DOGE team is rapidly shutting down these illegal payments” / X
10 Elon Musk on X: “Billions of taxpayer dollars to known FRAUDULENT entities are STILL being APPROVED by Treasury. This needs to STOP NOW!” / X
11 Fatima Hussein, “Elon Musk’s task force has gained access to sensitive Treasury payment systems, sources say,” PBS News, Feb. 2, 2025, https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/elon-musks-task-force-hasgained-access-to-sensitive-treasury-payment-systems-sources-say; Billy Bambrough, “‘This Needs To Stop Now’—Elon Musk Confirms Radical Doge U.S. Treasury Plan,” Forbes, Feb. 2, 2025, https://www.forbes.com/sites/digital-assets/2025/02/02/this-needs-to-stop-now-elon-musk-confirmsradical-doge-us-treasury-plan/.
It cites Elon’s insane rants on Xitter as well.
In addition to the privacy concerns addressed in the union lawsuit, the AGs’ lawsuit raises concerns about appropriations (and separation of powers), but also cybersecurity, something not included in the union lawsuit.
139. The conduct of DOGE members presents a unique security risk to States and State residents whose data is held by BFS, given that DOGE employees have already reportedly set up an unauthorized commercial server at another federal agency without a privacy impact assessment as required by the 2002 E-Government Act. Access by DOGE employees to BFS is likely to present even greater risks to the security and privacy of States’ and their residents’ data.
140. Unsecure data is susceptible to cyber attacks and identity theft. Identity theft has a significant impact on States, beyond the financial well-being of its residents. It strains law enforcement resources, damages state economies through lost productivity and consumer confidence, and raises costs for the state to redress fraudulent claims made from stolen identities for unemployment and healthcare benefits. [my emphasis]
The AGs’ suit actually doesn’t cite a source for the claim that DOGE set up a commercial server at another agency. But I think the claim comes from a lawsuit Kel McClanahan filed against Office of Personnel Management, aiming to require it to stop the all-government email DOGE [sic] set up to offer its “Fork in the Road” severance offer. McClanahan first sued, with two plaintiffs who worked at government agencies, on January 27, for a violation of the E-Government Act. [docket]
In response, the government claimed that the main theory of injury, that the government had set up the all-government email without first doing a privacy assessment didn’t apply for employees, and was moot because it had since done one, which it included here. The privacy assessment claimed this was just a Office365 account.
1.3. Has a system security plan been completed for the information system(s) supporting the project? The Office 365 mailbox has been granted an Authorization to Operate (ATO) that includes a system security plan. The government computer storing the data is subject to standard security requirements, including limited PIV access.
And it claimed that the account included only employee data.
2.1. Identify the information the project collects, uses, disseminates, or maintains. GWES collects, maintains, and uses the names and government email addresses of federal government employees. GWES also collects and redistributes responses to emails sent to those addresses, which are limited to short, voluntary, non-identifying information. Specifically, GWES contains the following:
- Employee Contact Data: GWES collects, maintains, and uses the names and government email addresses of federal government employees. Other identifying information is not used.
- Employee Response Data: After an email is sent using Employee Contact Data, GWES collects, maintains, and redistributes short, voluntary responses.
It largely ignored McClenahan’s claim (based largely on Reddit posts) that DOGE had installed a separate server.
But other than speculation on social media, Plaintiffs provide no evidence that OPM took any of the actions that would trigger the PIA requirement under sections 208(b)(1)(A)(i)-(ii) of the E-Government Act. Moreover, Plaintiffs disregard entirely the fact that the E-Government Act does not require a PIA when an agency is seeking to collect information about “agencies, instrumentalities, or employees of the Federal Government.”
Since then, McClanahan filed an amended complaint, which added five more plaintiffs, none of whom are Executive Branch employees (for example, one works for the Library of Congress; another is a contractor), substantiating that some of the DOGE emails went to people outside the Executive Branch, and provided additional substantiation of the Reddit claims (including raising questions about whether this could even be Microsoft365).
30. Furthermore, prior to 20 January 2025, OPM lacked the technical capacity to send direct communications to all Executive Branch employees: But just days before President Donald Trump’s inauguration, OPM did not have the capability to send a mass email of that scale, according to a person familiar with the matter. To send mass emails, the agency had used govDelivery, a cloud communications service provided by public sector IT company Granicus, a different person familiar said. The govDelivery contract had restrictions on the volume of emails available to send without incurring added costs, and the agency would not have been able to reach 2.3 million people, the approximate number of all civilian federal employees, the second person added. David DiMolfetta, OPM’s new email system sparks questions about cyber compliance Nextgov/FCW (Jan. 28, 2025), available at https://www.nextgov.com/digitalgovernment/2025/01/opms-new-email-system-sparks-questions-about-cybercompliance/402555/ (last accessed Feb. 3, 2025).
31. Additionally, OPM has used Microsoft Office 365 since at least 2021, including Outlook 365 for email. OPM, Privacy Impact Assessment for OPM – Microsoft Office 365 (May 13, 2021), available at https://www.opm.gov/information-management/privacy-policy/privacypolicy/office-365-pia.pdf (last accessed Feb. 3, 2025). Outlook 365 cannot send more than ten thousand emails per day. See Microsoft, Exchange Online limits (Dec. 11, 2024), at https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/office365/servicedescriptions/exchange-online-servicedescription/exchange-online-limits#sending-limits-1 (last accessed Feb. 3, 2025).
32. According to the FedNews Message, “Instead [of using the normal channels], an on-prem (on-site) email server was setup [sic]. Someone literally walked into our building and plugged in an email server to our network to make it appear that emails were coming from OPM. It’s been the one sending those various ‘test’ message[s] [discussed below].” FedNews Message.
33. This statement is supported by recent reporting:
A new server being used to control these [OPM] databases has been placed in a conference room that Musk’s team is using as their command center, according to an OPM staffer. The staffer described the server as a piece of commercial hardware they believed was not obtained through the proper federal procurement process.
Caleb Ecarma & Judd Legum, Musk associates given unfettered access to private data of government employees Musk Watch (Feb. 3, 2025), at https://www.muskwatch.com/p/muskassociates-given-unfettered (last accessed Feb. 3, 2025).
34. Upon information and belief, this server and/or other systems linked to it are retaining information about every individual with a Government email address.
The amended complaint argues that the privacy impact was factually and legally insufficient.
39. Neither Biasini nor Hogan were OPM employees prior to 20 January.
40. Biasini worked at the Boring Company prior to 20 January. It is not currently known if he still works there.
41. Hogan worked at Comma.ai prior to 20 January. It is not currently known if he still works there.
42. The GWES PIA was both factually inaccurate and legally inadequate.
[snip]
54. Upon information and belief, OPM has not ensured review of a PIA for any of these systems by any legally sufficient Chief Information Officer or equivalent official.
55. OPM has not published a legally sufficient PIA or made such an assessment available for public inspection for any of these systems.
In other words, as these twin lawsuits against Treasury get closer to arguing that Elon is not looking for savings but instead altering the payment system, McClanahan continues to chase proof that Elon’s DOGE [sic] boys have added their own server which, by dint of sending emails to everyone (including people not employed by the Executive branch) with a .gov address, is collecting information on everyone with a .gov address.
Meanwhile, several other developments get closer to showing that Elon is hacking the government, not assessing it.
First, late this week, OPM removed access by some DOGE [sic] boys to more sensitive OPM systems.
Directives from the agency’s interim leadership issued late this week indicated that DOGE representatives should be withdrawn from two principal systems containing personally identifiable information for millions of federal employees, according to communications reviewed by The Post and people familiar with the developments who spoke on the condition of anonymity because of the matter’s sensitivity.
Those systems are called Enterprise Human Resources Integration and Electronic Official Personnel Folder. They hold sensitive information about employees of most federal agencies, including addresses, demographic profiles, salary details and disciplinary histories.
The Post reported Thursday morning that DOGE agents had gained access to those systems along with “administrative” access to OPM computer systems. That allowed them sweeping authority to install and modify software on government-supplied equipment and, according to two OPM officials, to alter internal documentation of their own activities.
Meanwhile, both Wired and WaPo have stories describing how a Booz Allen analyst described the DOGE [sic] access as an ““unprecedented insider threat risk;” the analyst was promptly fired.
The review, delivered Monday to Treasury officials by a contractor that runs a threat intelligence center for Treasury’s Bureau of the Fiscal Service, said that DOGE’s access to the payment network should be “immediately” suspended. It also urged Treasury to scour the payments system for any changes approved by affiliates of DOGE, which is overseen by billionaire Elon Musk, the correspondence shows. DOGE stands for Department of Government Efficiency.
A Treasury employee told The Post that the threat center is run by Booz Allen Hamilton, a large federal contractor. The company confirmed it runs the threat center, which it said is embedded within Treasury.
Late Friday, after this article appeared, Booz Allen said it had “removed” a subcontractor who wrote the warning and would seek to retract or amend it. “The draft report was prepared by a subcontractor to Booz Allen and contained unauthorized personal opinions that are not factual or consistent with our standards,” company spokesperson Jessica Klenk said. Booz Allen won more than $1 billion in multiyear U.S. government contracts last year.
In a separate communication a week ago, a high-ranking career official at Treasury also raised the issue of risks from DOGE access in a memo to Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent, including the potential breach of information that could lead to exposure of U.S. spies abroad, according to five people with knowledge of the matter, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to reflect government deliberations. The memo included recommendations to mitigate risks, which Bessent approved, said another person familiar with the matter, who also spoke on the condition of anonymity.
And while the focus at Treasury has been on eugenicist Marko Elez, whom Elon has pushed to be reinstated, closer scrutiny into Edward “Big Balls” Coristine — who is at OPM and possibly HHS — has described he has ties to hackers. Brian Krebs, who was targeted by some people in that crowd, described screen shots that suggest Coristine may have been fired for leaking internal documents to a competitor.
Wired noted that Coristine only worked at Path for a few months in 2022, but the story didn’t mention why his tenure was so short. A screenshot shared on the website pathtruths.com includes a snippet of conversations in June 2022 between Path employees discussing Coristine’s firing.
According to that record, Path founder Marshal Webb dismissed Coristine for leaking internal documents to a competitor. Not long after Coristine’s termination, someone leaked an abundance of internal Path documents and conversations. Among other things, those chats revealed that one of Path’s technicians was a Canadian man named Curtis Gervais who was convicted in 2017 of perpetrating dozens of swatting attacks and fake bomb threats — including at least two attempts against our home in 2014.
And Krebs provides chatlogs showing some of Coristine’s former associates are taking notice.
The Com is the English-language cybercriminal hacking equivalent of a violent street gang. KrebsOnSecurity has published numerous stories detailing how feuds within the community periodically spill over into real-world violence.
When Coristine’s name surfaced in Wired‘s report this week, members of The Com immediately took notice. In the following segment from a February 5, 2025 chat in a Com-affiliated hosting provider, members criticized Rivage’s skills, and discussed harassing his family and notifying authorities about incriminating accusations that may or may not be true.
Bloomberg matched Krebs’ reporting on the reason for Coristine’s firing from Path.
“Edward has been terminated for leaking internal information to the competitors,” said a June 2022 message from an executive of the firm, Path Network, which was seen by Bloomberg News. “This is unacceptable and there is zero tolerance for this.”
A spokesperson for the Arizona-based hosting and data-security firm said Thursday: “I can confirm that Edward Coristine’s brief contract was terminated after the conclusion of an internal investigation into the leaking of proprietary company information that coincided with his tenure.”
Afterward, Coristine wrote that he’d retained access to the cybersecurity company’s computers, though he said he hadn’t taken advantage of it.
“I had access to every single machine,” he wrote on Discord in late 2022, weeks after he was dismissed from Path Network, according to messages seen by Bloomberg. Posting under the name “Rivage,” which six people who know him said was his alias, Coristine said he could have wiped Path’s customer-supporting servers if he’d wished. He added, “I never exploited it because it’s just not me.”
Bloomberg tied Coristine’s past even more closely to organized abuse campaigns.
JoeyCrafter was a member of Telegram groups called “Kiwi Farms Christmas Chat” and “Kiwi Farms 100% Real No Fake No Virus,” both referencing an online forum known for harassment campaigns. Typically, the site has been used to share the personal information of a target, encouraging others to harass them online, in-person, over the phone or by falsely alerting police to a violent crime or active shooter incident at their home.
This is the kind of DOGE boy Elon has thrown at government networks — and thus far, Republicans don’t seem to give a damn that Trump has given these DOGE [sic] boys access to data on virtually all Americans, employee or no.
One thing is clear, however: There’s not a shred of evidence these boys are doing what Elon claims they’re doing.
Most of these new facts — the seeming proof that OPM isn’t doing what it claimed, the insider threat warning, the ties to hackers — are not in the AGs’ suit. And by the time the suits catch up to the facts, the complaints may look quite different.
Update: Corrected that none of the OPM plaintiffs are employees of US Courts (though they did get an email).
From the TRO:
” … immediately destroy any and all copies of material downloaded from the Treasury Department’s records and systems…”
Does the judge understand that an AI trained on that material is not a copy of it?
I’d bet they also installed back doors in case there was an injunction like this.
I receive SSI, Medicaid and SNAP in a red state whose budget is 40% federal aid. Already hearing of Head Start programs and community health clinics closing because they still can’t draw down funds.
If I still have full benefits disbursed timely by April I will consider it a miracle between fund/employee slashing or catastrophic collapse of critical Treasury systems from kids who know nothing about legacy systems or COBOL.
Musk and his tech terrorists should be stopped from entering another government department, as what he is doing with our data, our kids data may be worse than we are imagining.
I am sorry to relay this, but, if this post could heighten urgency around this data coup, then it would be worth it, disturbing as it is:
Quoting parts of two posts:
bsky.app/profile/jim-stewartson.bsky.social/post/3lhouynpd5k2r
Jim Stewartson
DOGE employee Edward Coristine was a member of this group of Satanic National Socialist (Nazism) pedophiles called 764 that “target, groom, extort and cause physical and psychological harm to victims as young as 10.”
Any more questions about what’s going on here?
He has access to YOUR data.
………….
I’m guessing, our kids’ data too.
Holy shit. Here’s a better link, to the investigative reporter who’s being quoted:
https://krebsonsecurity.com/
Brian Krebs isn’t to be taken lightly. Read his “about” page.
This is the kind of thing that could bring the whole fucking shit show down. Seriously. It will affect all of the current DOGE suits in progress. It will taint Musk (and by deep association, Trump) with not just Satanism but pedophilia. It will threaten to disaffect the entire Christian nationalist segment of Trump’s base.
This needs to get major air time, asap.
Adder to my comment just above: this report will need to be vetted, despite Krebs’ significant credentials, because of this, from his Wiki page:
**”On March 29, 2022, Ubiquiti, a publicly traded technology company founded in San Jose, California, filed a lawsuit[24] against Brian Krebs and his blog Krebs on Security, in United States District Court for the Eastern District of Virginia. Ubiquiti’s defamation complaint alleged “Krebs avoided obvious sources of public information that rebut his false and preconceived narrative against Ubiquiti, and Krebs doubled down on his attack against Ubiquiti despite possessing uncontroverted evidence that his source was incredible and actually involved in the attack” and that “he was determined to publish stories that adhere to his preconceived narrative that Ubiquiti and other companies.”[25] According to an article[26] by ars TECHNICA, Ubiquiti claimed Krebs was “intentionally deceitful” and “financially incentivized” to not correct information the company alleged to be inaccurate. On August 31, 2022, Krebs posted an apology[27] admitting his “sole source” for his blog post was indicted by federal prosecutors for among other things “providing false information to the press.” He closes his statement by saying he “missed the mark and, as a result, I would like to extend my sincerest apologies to Ubiquiti.” The following day attorneys for both parties made a joint motion for “Stipulation of Dismissal”.[28]**
Despite his significant awards and recognition, the MAGA will hammer him on that admitted major blunder. Even if this story is corroborated in full by other parties, he won’t be the right person to bring it to the fore.
I wonder when they’re going to eliminate traditional Medicare and Medigap and make “Medicare recipients” that want health coverage, have to choose a Medicare Advantage plan.
“Advantage” is primarily Medicare Part D coverage.
Fancy Chicken, I am sorry for your plight, both present and potential. When will these bozos realize that screwing with disbursement of federal tax dollars almost invariably hurts red states more than blue ones?
Red states tend to be poor. They take in far more than they pay out in taxes; the reverse is true of rich blue states, especially Connecticut where I live, New Jersey, and a few others. We have long subsidized states like Alabama and Mississippi via our federal taxes–in return for less electoral college representation *and* gerrymandering up the yazoo.
Elon threatens that leveling of the playing field. Sure, he’s probably filching it for himself, but he’ll be filching it from the folks in red states who rely on blue state largesse to make up for longterm relative poverty and disadvantage.
Thank you.
There are millions of people in my situation. The up side of this situation is that if enough people are effected before things get really out of hand we could be a powerhouse of a pressure campaign.
Could you expand on this? Do you think a person’s name, address and SSN is not subject to the laws around them if it is aggregated through AI? I’m genuinely interested in an explanation.
I am not an expert on AI, nor on Federal privacy law, but what is `a copy’?
If a database of SSN, bank account numbers or other identifiers is put into another form,
say as an algorithm or a program, is that a copy?
I fear that the law is so far behind the technology that
those who claim to be just calling balls and strikes will call a ball on this one.
Thanks for responding – I am always on the lookout for someone who has experience with these systems, as mine is out-of-date and I’m an AI skeptic.
Speculating here, it would seem reasonable that how one copies information should not matter, whether it is on toilette paper or a hard drive. As long as you have the pipeline “information X on medium A” –> “stuff on medium B” and that the information X can be reconstructed from whatever is located on medium B, then you have a copy. The concept should apply perhaps even if X can only be statistically reconstructed.
FWIW
The plain intent of the order is to preserve the status quo ante
Ie it treats access to the systems and information as unauthorised unless by Treasury Department Officials performing their duties as per (ii), the intent of the order as per (iii) is to destroy all records of the information obtained from the systems intruded upon including information about the operation of the systems themselves.
The question as to whether the order as drafted is adequate to fulfill what I perceive is its intent, is a legitimate one.
I would hope that the interim injunction the plaintiffs intend to pursue addresses what is or maybe a lacuna.
The discovery process should shed some* light on what information etc was stolen and what the defendants did with it (*of course the cheating bastards are going to lie and cheat on these obligations too, but hopefully the process will at least expose them as evasive and dishonourable, and so serve as a basis for appropriate inferences made against them, and thus more stringent orders and sanctions )
One mechanism for closing the lacuna might be adding a definition to the order eg:
“Copy” for the purpose of the order is defined broadly, and as such includes any record whether physical or electronic, of information from or about the system obtained by accessing it as described, including by processing such information by any information or computer processes of any sort including any so called artificial intelligence program of any type or description.
Nathan Tankus has v good reporting on the situation at Treasury:
https://www.crisesnotes.com/
@nathantankus.bsky.social
He has a good grasp of both the technical and financial industry contexts.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-07-02/nathan-tankus-s-newsletter-subscribers-don-t-care-about-diplomas
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As it’s been pointed out here, Musk doesn’t respect court orders. He’ll just keep doing what he wants. So I’m not confident this order makes any difference.
I fear the confusion surrounding the technology aspects will prolong the potential risks.
A Dangerous Lack Of Clarity: Does DOGE’s Negotiated “Read Only” Access Mean “Read Only” Access To Data Or Code?
https://www.techdirt.com/2025/02/06/a-dangerous-lack-of-clarity-does-doges-negotiated-read-only-access-mean-read-only-access-to-data-or-code/
I’d like to get DOGE out of government. (Pronounce it “Dodge”.)
I apologize if this is a repeat of someone else’s reply on another post . The .gov page is still up, but this link to the Experian website is more comprehensive:
How to Freeze Your Credit at All 3 Credit Bureaus
I had issues with Equifax (via phone), so it may be an action many are taking right now.
I clicked link, and article I tried to post is not on server.
Perhaps, following Jim Stewartson on sky social is better. He has very disturbing reports on the worst people imaginable taking our data…and our kids data, for the worst of reasons.
@jim-stewartson.bsky.social
As someone once claimed:
We’re an empire now (with a real live emperor) and when we act we create our own reality, and while you are filing lawsuits to enjoin that reality…. yada, yada. yadi…wash, rinse, repeat
Oh, Chalmers Johnson argued that the US has been an empire for quite some time.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chalmers_Johnson
We were an economic empire from about 1945 to about 2000.
I don’t see the rationale for a cut-off date.
After about 2000, I think we became a post-industrial country. With a big military.
It has been observed that in the 21st century, the U.S. government is primarily a health and retirement insurance management company, with a large standing army.
Reply to Purple Martin
February 10, 2025 at 12:06 am
Can we not repeat right-wing talking points like this? You’re repeating the bullshit excuse they’re using for killing everything except the standing army.
Rayne, I consider that neither right-wing nor inaccurate. But I’m often enough wrong…your mileage may differ and I respect your insight.
It’s an identification, per budget impact, of the two critical government missions Elon’s vandals will have have to cut before succeeding in any meaningful lasting results beyond the next six months’ performative impact.
And yes, we can’t ignore that the current short-term performative damage is entirely bad enough, not just for the human harm caused but if successful now, setting the stage for destruction of one of those two critical missions. You can guess one…they’re not likely to much mess with the other.
But Marcy’s post and a bunch of thoughtful comments here give me hope they’ll not get away with this first attempted step, in a way that will let them proceed unimpeded to their larger chaos. It’s already likely to take at least a decade to recover from the Trump Decade but the initial and accelerating Article III response is, to me, encouraging in its potential to make that decade instead of decades.
I’ve been wondering what the DOGE access to government computer systems will do to criminal cases which rely on evidence from these systems. My initial thinking is “access and change logs would tell you what they’ve done,” but that assumes that they have not modified or disabled those logs.
I could see ramifications to chain of custody, falsification of evidence, improper parallel construction …
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“I love Donald Trump as much as any straight man can love another man.”
–Elon Musk
“Roy Cohn isn’t gay, he just likes to have sex with other men.”
–Trump’s pal Roger Stone on Trump’s pal Roy Cohn
Mm…okay, if you say so. Thanks for letting us know. No judgement here.
Would a confident man have to qualify his praise for another man?
What I wonder, read-only vs read-write, seems to ignore who/what does the reading.
Specifically, Musk’s Colossus 100,000 GPU energy-suck installation in Memphis, an xAI asset, can “read” the data into its neural network on single or multi-pass tuning of the net (not making a copy, mind you, just tuning an asset) to then be query “prompted” such as: “Sumarize for me the data in this one-pass read having to do with Marcy Wheeler,” and have the incrementally retrained base network of billions of parameters and millions or more of network nodes in however many layers there, running on 100,000 Nvidia processors, then respond to the prompt with a final sentence, “Is there anything more specific you would want me to answer?”
Technically, that is read only, and is not making a copy. The muskrats apparently still have that capability, yes/no. They surely have the skill set.
Who says “summarise” does not generate a copy of information contained in the “summary”?
There is No FAIR USE principle applicable to hacked / stolen information/data/intellectual property.
Sometimes I just need to laugh. I approve your use of “muskrats” to describe Musk’s minions, but I’ve been hoping that “MuskBrats” would become ubiquitous. Potato, potato.
Ray Lutz had a substack about something that could be used anywhere to possibly install back doors:
USB Hacker Tool Could Change Virtually Any Election Results, Given Access
Hacker USB “Utility Knife” can quickly take over and subvert any system!
Ray Lutz Feb 07, 2025
https://substack.com/home/post/p-156649711
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As to *what* may “read” data online, “Building Colossus: Supermicro’s groundbreaking AI supercomputer built for Elon Musk’s xAI” https://venturebeat.com/ai/building-colossus-supermicros-groundbreaking-ai-supercomputer-built-for-elon-musks-xai/
See, also, “Memphis warns it may not be able to power Elon Musk’s lofty ‘Colossus’ supercomputer expansion plans,” https://fortune.com/2025/01/07/memphis-utility-ceo-warns-power-supply-elon-musk-xai-colossus-supercomputer-facility/ (paywalled, but showing enough to show the power-suck scale of Musk’s beast computer, so grok that). There’s more on the web, easily searched about what Musk’s had built. It “reads.”
DOGE Teen Owns ‘Tesla . Sexy LLC’ and Worked at Startup That Has Hired Convicted Hackers
Experts question whether Edward Coristine, a DOGE staffer who has gone by “Big Balls” online, would pass the background check typically required for access to sensitive US government systems.
https://www.wired.com/story/edward-coristine-tesla-sexy-path-networks-doge/
[Moderator’s note: see your comment at 12:42 pm. /~Rayne]
speculation is unwelcome at this site, i know. (anger and bile produce these responses –)
why would anyone want to undermine american demonstrated excellence in fields, such as academic, scientific?
is this possibly a vast immature boy-toys scam to steal american intellectual property, to sell to the highest bidder in other (less successful?) nation states?
BAH!
Billionaires don’t want governments getting in the way of doing whatever they want.
I didn’t see it mentioned but Senate Intelligence Committee Dems (and Angus King) sent this letter to Susie Wiles:
https://www.kelly.senate.gov/wp-content/uploads/2025/02/DOGE-Letter.pdf
Given all the fuck ups by Team Trump so far, I’m not too becalmed by assurances from OPM that no commercial server was used for the email system used to send out government-wide emails:
1. The email system installed was likely not properly vetted by intelligence review, and
2. any hackster could fairly easily insert a usb into any port available in any workstation they had access to (this is a commercially-available hacking method), injecting compromising software into the system. (Same thing at Treasury)
I hope the Senators get satisfactory answers to their questions.
See, for example BadUSB. Simply inserting a tiny USB device into an available port can hijack a computer. Good security practices disable USB ports in public environments but I’m sure the US Gov’t doesn’t have pristine security practices.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BadUSB
While trump is sensitive about his public image, musk is not. But I think his real exposure may be the tesla market. Boycott tesla and the tesla brand, and shame tesla owners. This is the largest source of his wealth.
Not knowing much about computers beyond accessing blogs, turning it on and off, and email these days, at one time, starting in 1971 when computers were being introduced into the work place of Canadian federal government office, it was interesting to find out what those computer could do and what others found they could do. What Musk and his boys are up to, I’d expect, leaving methods to access the computers later, getting as much information off of them and perhaps even sending it elsewhere. It just boggles the mind that some billionaire can just waltz into the American computer system and play there to their hearts content. My take on Musk is that there is something missing in his brain. Perhaps its because there hasn’t been any negative consequences for some of his previous actions, who knows, but Americans might want to get rid of him and his boys before nasty things start happening to citizens who don’t agree with Trump and his cabal. The thing which really worries me, is what if Musk and his gang rob the American government via the computers. It would be easier than getting into the gold fault.
They’re claiming that DOGE found that most of the treasury’s bills are fake…which, for me, raises the question that they shouldn’t be able to say that without forensic accountants spending a few weeks analyzing all the bills that Treasury deals with. And NONE of those in DOGE are accountants of any kind.
That’s called a lie. This is Elon Musk we’re talking about.
Forensic accounting. That’s the only real way to find fraud. And other financial crimes. Which I continue to say on social media in hopes others will learn.
I’m in complete agreement with you.
Root of racism for Musk.
Democracy Now
“The PayPal Mafia”: The South African Oligarchs Surrounding Trump, from Elon Musk to Peter Thiel
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAHSgVk84B0)
Just saw this come across the wire (NYT):
“Elon Musk Leads Bid to Buy OpenAI for $97.4 Billion”
I’m sure that will end well.
He had trouble coming up with half that much money to buy the bird hellsite. Why would anyone believe he can come up with more than twice that, when his businesses are not making profits?
Also he hasn’t demonstrated that he can actually run *anything* bigger than a one-man office.
OpenAi says”no thanks”
https://www.sfgate.com/news/politics/article/elon-musk-led-group-proposes-buying-openai-for-20159315.php
Not only “no thanks”, but “actually, we’ll offer that amount to buy Xitter”
Better yet, he offered $.10 on the dollar for Xitter.
Disappointing only in that it would have been another way for Elmo to lose another $60 billion, as OpenAI’s shares tanked after his purchase. I imagine he expects to make multiples of that by raiding the USG’s most secure data sets.
“The Tech Coup:” Expert Warns of Silicon Valley’s Influence on Washington | Amanpour and Company
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8lvUwrmMtFA)