Were Proud Boys Using Livestream for Command and Control … and Other Operational Questions

Mapping out both the four charged conspiracy indictments against the Proud Boys as well as some — not all — of those with links to the groups who have not been included in the conspiracy indictments, has raised specific questions for me about how the Proud Boys operated that day and how they’re being prosecuted.

Were the Proud Boys using livestreams for command and control?

I’ve had this question more generally: whether someone offsite from the Capitol was providing Command and Control guidance for the assault on the Capitol. But the new “Leadership conspiracy” indictment against Ethan Nordean and Joe Biggs mentions that Gabriel Garcia — along with Joshua Pruitt — were among those who charged on the Capitol in the first wave, along with Dominic Pezzola.

That, by itself, makes me wonder if DOJ is going to expand that “Front Door” conspiracy to include Garcia and Pruitt.

But the content of Garcia’s charging document raises more questions for me.

Garcia is a former Army Captain, so one of the higher ranking former veterans among the Proud Boy defendants. He may have been IDed by what we now know was a request that Facebook provide the IDs associated with all the livestream video uploaded during the insurrection from inside the Capitol (indeed, it was Garcia’s complaint that first led me to suspect the FBI had used one).

Based on information provided by Facebook, Facebook User ID (“UID”) 100000183142825 has a Facebook account under the name “GABRIEL GARCIA.” GARCIA uploaded to his Facebook account at least two “Facebook live” videos taken inside of the Capitol building on January 6, 2021. Additionally, GARCIA uploaded at least one video before entering the Capitol building.


In the video, GARCIA is walking east on Constitution Avenue towards the Capitol building with a large group of people. 2

Approximately 20 minutes later, at 19:19:08 UTC, or 02:19pm, GARCIA uploaded to Facebook a video filmed from inside the Capitol building:

If you were following Garcia’s livestreams in real time — even from a remote location — you would have visibility on what was going on inside almost immediately after the first group of the Proud Boys breached the Capitol.

In a later livestream, Garcia narrated what happened in the minutes after the Proud Boys had breached the Capitol.

GARCIA states, “We just went ahead and stormed the Capitol. It’s about to get ugly.” Around him, a large crowd chants, “Our house!”

Then, as a standoff with some cops ensued, Garcia filmed himself describing, tactically, what was happening, and also making suggestions to escalate violence that were heeded by those around him.

At minute 1:34, a man tries to run through the line of USCP officers. The officers respond with force, which prompts GARCIA to shout, “You fucking traitors! You fucking traitors! Fuck you!” As the USCP officers try to maintain positive control of the man that just rushed the police line, GARCIA yells, “grab him!” seemingly instructing the individuals around him to retrieve the man from USCP officers. GARCIA is holding a large American flag, which he drops into the skirmish in an apparent attempt to assist the individuals who are struggling with the USCP officers.

USCP officers maintain control of the line, holding out their arms to keep the crowd from advancing. At least one USCP officer deploys an asp. GARCIA turns the camera on himself and offers tactical observations regarding the standoff. [my emphasis]

Garcia’s livestream was such that you would obtain crowd size estimates from it, as well as specific names of officers on the front line, as well as instructions to “keep ’em coming,” seemingly asking for more bodies for this confrontation.

At minute 3:26, GARCIA, who is still in extremely close proximity to the USCP officer line again yells, “Fucking traitors!” He then joins the crowd chanting “Our house!” At minute 3:38, GARCIA states, “You ain’t stopping a million of us.” He then turns the camera to the crowd behind him and says, “Keep ‘em coming. Keep ‘em coming. Storm this shit.” GARCIA chants with the crowd, “USA!”

Soon after, GARCIA stops chanting and begins speaking off camera with someone near him. At minute 4:28, GARCIA says, “do you want water?” Though unclear, GARCIA seems to be asking the person with whom he is speaking. GARCIA is so close to an officer that, as the camera shifts, the only images captured are those of the officer’s chest and badge. [my emphasis]

Remarkably, Garcia filmed himself successfully ordering the rioters to hold the line — which they do — and then filmed them charging the police.

GARCIA yells, “Back up! Hold the line!” Shortly thereafter, the crowd begins advancing, breaching the USCP officer line. GARCIA says, “Stop pushing.” The last moments captured in the video are of the crowd rushing the USCP officers.

In the arrest affidavit for the Kansas City Proud Boys, a footnote describes how Nicholas Ochs and Nicholas DeCarlo were similarly filming what was going on as the Kansas City Proud Boys successfully thwarted police efforts to shut down access to the tunnels.

Proud Boys Nicholas Ochs and Nicholas DeCarlo can be seen in the background recording the unlawful conduct with their phones and other devices.

While their arrest documents don’t show the two livestreaming on Facebook (and Ochs would later complain about the connectivity inside the Capitol), if they were livestreaming somewhere, it would mean live video of tactically important moments from the siege would have been available to someone outside the Capitol or even someone watching more remotely, from a hotel room or even Florida.

Certainly, Garcia’s stream would be operationally useful if someone were providing command and control remotely. Was someone?

Does DOJ now have a list of all the teams from the Telegram channels?

The latest detention motions for Ethan Nordean and Joe Biggs (as well as the Leadership Conspiracy indictment) describe the process of divvying up the Proud Boys in attendance into teams, which process involves an unindicted co-conspirator who presumably is cooperating.

January 4, 8:20 PM, unindicted co-conspirator: “We had originally planned on breaking the guys into teams. Let’s start divying them up and getting baofeng channels picked out.”

January 5, 9:30 to 9:32 AM, Biggs: “What are the teams. I keep hearing team [sic] are picked already.” A few minutes later, [Biggs] stated “Who are we going to be with. I have guys with me in other chats saying teams are being put together.”

January 5, 9:17 to 9:20 PM, Biggs: “We just had a meeting woth [sic] a lot of guys. Info should be coming out” … “I was able to rally everyone here together who came where I said” … “We have a plan. I’m with [Nordean]. [my emphasis]

The replication of these Telegram chats, from two different channels, stops at 10AM on January 6 (they presumably continued after that time, but we know that Nordean’s phone was turned off during the day).

That suggests DOJ is likely to know what the various teams were and who led them. There were 60 people on the participants’ Telegram channel from that day, which means they may have a lot more teams to indict.

Who paid for the vans from Florida to DC?

The detention memo for Christopher Worrell, a Proud Boy who sprayed law enforcement with pepper spray, reveals that he and his girlfriend traveled to DC on vans paid for by someone else and stayed in hotels also paid for by someone else.

According to Worrell’s live-in girlfriend, who was interviewed by law enforcement on March 12, 2021, she and Worrell traveled to Washington D.C. in the days leading up to January 6, 2021, with other Proud Boys in vans paid for by another individual. Their hotel rooms were also paid for by another individual.

Particularly given that these vans were from Florida — where Tarrio, Biggs, and the key figures from the Oath Keepers all hung out (and hung out with Roger Stone) — the person that paid for these things may be on the hook for any conspiracy ultimately charged as a whole.

What kind of cooperation will DOJ get from the Front Door co-conspirators?

As of right now, just Dominic Pezzola and William Pepe are charged in what I call the “Front Door” conspiracy — the group of people who first breached the Capitol on the west side of the building. As noted above, DOJ itself identified Garcia and Pruitt to have some tie to this group (which makes me wonder if an expanded conspiracy obtained Friday will be released before I’m done with this post!).

But DOJ has not included Robert Gieswein or Ryan Samsel, who were also part of this initial assault. Neither is described as a Proud Boy in their charging documents, but both were with the Proud Boys before the operation. Both men are also on the hook for fairly serious assault charges (a cop that Samsel pushed over got a concussion and Gieswein brought a bat he used). Samsel has not been indicted and the joint request for a continuance (filed way back on February 17) explaining why explicitly states the two sides are seeking a “resolution,” (that is, a plea deal).

The government and counsel for the defendant have conferred, and are continuing to communicate in an effort to resolve this matter.

As to Gieswein, he has been indicted. But his docket has none of the proceedings that cases moving towards trial would have, such as a motion for a protective order (though given the delays on PACER postings that doesn’t definitely mean anything). And well after his magistrate docket in Colorado was closed, he submitted several sealed filings to it.

If I were someone that the government had dead to rights with not just brutal assault, but assault that was tactically important to the success of the entire operation, particularly if I had a criminal record that would add to prison time at sentencing (as Samsel does), I would sure want to help prosecutors assign some responsibility for those assaults to those who guided my actions on that day. Thus far, assault is not included in any of the conspiracy indictments (it is individually charged against Pezzola and a threatened assault was charged against William Chrestman), but if it were, it would raise the stakes of them significantly.

I’m also interested in the case of Chris Kelly. He’s not a Proud Boy. But in advance of his trip, he made it public that he was traveling to DC from NY with some members of the Proud Boys.

I’ll be with ex NYPD and some proud boys. This will be the most historic event of my life.

Kelly also made it clear the NYPD officer was his brother.

The Kelly Facebook Account also shows on January 2, 2021 KELLY messaged another user and stated, “Me and [NAME] plus a couple of others are headed down the 5th and staying 2 nights. Ill be frequency 462.662 on a ham radio if cell service goes down.” Public records databases also revealed Christopher M Kelly has a brother (“S1”) of New City, New York with the same first name used in the above statement. New York City Police Department records confirm S1 is a retired police officer. Based on this statement, and the statement above about traveling with “ex NYPD and some proud boys” your affiant believes that this comment indicated that KELLY planned to travel to Washington, D.C. with S1.

We still don’t know who a cooperating witness against Pezzola and Pepe is, who described to the FBI, almost immediately, a conversation promising that the Proud Boys would have killed Mike Pence had they found him that day. Pezzola had suspected that it was the guy who first recruited him into the Proud Boys and further speculated the conversation reported by the witness occurred on the trip home (which would help to explain how Pepe, also from NY, got included in conspiracy charges with Pezzola). That is, Pezzola believed that the cooperating witness must have been in a car with him from DC to NY.

But the government revealed that they are not prosecuting this cooperating witness.

The defendant speculates that W-1 is a “cooperating witness” with deeper ties to the Proud Boys than the defendant. The defense is incorrect. W-1 has not been charged with a crime in connection with the events of January 6, 2021, and the government is unaware of any affiliation between W-1 and the Proud Boys or any indication that W-1 knew the defendant prior to January 5, 2021.

Kelly can’t be that witness. He had already been charged at the time. But unless I missed his arrest, Kelly’s brother might be. And if his brother were cooperating (which would require honest testimony about what brother Chris had done), then it would raise the chances that Chris Kelly would be too. And why not? If I had traveled to DC with the people who initiated the entire insurrection, I’d want to make damned clear that I wasn’t part of that. Like Samsel, Kelly has not been indicted (publicly) yet.

For some time, the government had been saying they weren’t prepared to make plea deals yet. The inclusion of Co-Conspirator 1 in the Leadership indictment strongly suggests that’s done. And if Samsel and the government were discussing a plea over a month ago, you can be sure he has already proffered testimony to the government.

So the government likely has some cooperators in the “Front Door” conspiracy. The question is only, how much?

105 replies
  1. Amers says:

    I am remembering Trump’s recorded video telling his fans to go home and the part that really stood out to me in the moment was his phrase, you see what happens.

      • Amers says:

        I took his phrase to mean, good job getting all that video data showing how the capitol is defended so you can give it another go sometime in the future.

        • subtropolis says:

          I took it to be thinly disguised menacing. It fit that mendacious, narcissistic scumbag’s MO perfectly. Even as he was forced to call back his stormtroopers he couldn’t not add a dig at the republicans who’d failed to comply with his demand that they do everything that they could to stop the process going forward. That line was both a threat and twisted justification. It’s the kind of thing that a serial abuser snarls at his wife after shattering the cartilage in her nose.

    • Amers says:

      One other thought, upon rewatching the events unfold for law makers on live tv, I was struck by how many GOP, during floor debate, were staring at their phones vs how many Dems.

  2. BobCon says:

    How well does Facebook know who was watching both Garcia and anyone else doing similar communications?

    I realize it gets tricky with burner accounts and people with legitimate interests, like law enforcement, but a lot of this conspiracy seems sloppy.

    • Yancy says:

      I livestreamed lots of concerts on FB Live, the final one on Feb 23, 2020. When anyone starts watching the stream, it displays on the streamer’s smartphone or other device that viewer by name. It’s similar to Periscope: Jane Doe is now (live) viewing.
      FB must keep track of the other users viewing because when I would begin a stream, messages encouraging me to invite people who had previously watched to watch the current FB Live video.
      Oh, but my account is set to private, allowing only my Friends to watch. I’m not sure if people can view public FB Live videos from a browser, without logging in to Facebook.

  3. harpie says:

    I’ll mention this, in case it’s related. The other day, EUREKA posted a VIDEO isolated from the ProPublica Parler piece.

    The VIDEO takes place at 2:47 PM Eureka explains:
    [Does someone know which side of the building this is?]

    […] Back to 2:47 PM near the Capitol building: Rehl and another Philly PB (see Background below) gesture-forward, towards themselves closer to the building, a person who is filming as he approaches and joins them. As the filmer enters this group (and after someone notes that they heard that Pence has left), someone in the immediate group says, “You guys wanna go in?” (Rehl is seen to be speaking at the same time but video doesn’t seem to match audio for him to be the speaker of this remark.) […]

  4. harpie says:

    I agree with Marcy’s thought in this twitter thread about the NYT video investigation from yesterday, “We’ve Lost The Line!”:

    […] The more I think about the East side the more important it seems. Why would the Oath Keepers leave the Trump speech early (as another great NYT video showed) and walk AROUND the Capitol to the far side? […]

    • subtropolis says:

      For the same reason that the Proud Boys were on station long before the majority of the mob had arrived. They were thinning out the complex’s defenses.

      Just imagine had those bombs exploded. While that likely would have hastened the arrival of the National Guard, the immediate effect would have been to keep a hell of a lot of police from reaching the Capitol as they dealt with that.

      That there were two bombs was not just so that each party might feel threatened, imho. (Or, to suggest that each was equally unpatriotic, or whatever.) A second explosion would guarantee that a huge portion of downtown would have had to be evacuated, for fear of a third. That would require a lot of cops, weakening the Capitol significantly. Many of those in the line that day were Metro.

      • Ginevra diBenci says:

        As the investigative net gets weighed down with more and more indictees, I’m wondering if there’s already been a tipster among them who knew the provenance of those bombs. The hoodie’d figure in the surveillance video (bomb depositor) probably didn’t make them; that person looks barely out of their teens–and female, which would not disqualify them for explosives, of course. I would think we would hear more, and more urgent, calls for public information if investigators had no leads.

        • Lady4Real says:

          That person was a female and looked to be struggling a bit carrying the bag.

          I also believe someone else built those bombs and that the FBI is working on an arrest because that was a big number reward money.

        • JVO says:

          Thank the universe we will not know!

          I speculate that was the rat-fuckers actual objective – to find out exactly this but they were smart enough rat-fuckers to know they couldn’t proceed to run such an op without an actual predicate upon which to run such an op.

          There is the possibility that the real result could have been that they would have gotten away with it – it’s pretty obvious to me that they were trying.

        • PeterS says:

          Okay, the president declares martial law and what happens next? What does the military leadership do?

        • Kathleen Galt says:

          Seems as if a successful violent insurgency (by outside forces) intended to stop the formal joint session to count the electoral college votes ,would be considered a “breakdown of government.”

        • Lady4Real says:

          I believe the military would have refused any illegal orders at that point. I also believe that Joe Biden would’ve been inaugurated on schedule. The other part of the plot would’ve probably lasted just long enough to create another huge protest. Trump is a nasty gangster, but quite stupid.

        • PeterS says:

          Yes. I commented a few days ago that it was clear way before January 6 that the military was not going to play ball with that gangster. I was curious if jvo had a new insight into how martial law would work.

  5. Raven Eye says:

    Interesting is Kelly’s “…Ill be frequency 462.662 on a ham radio if cell service goes down.”

    462.662 MHz is very close to 462.6625 MHz – FRS/GMRS (Family Radio Service / General Mobile Radio Service) channel 5. That could be a typo, intentional, or a limitation with the radio’s display.

    It is a fairly good indication that they were using re-programmed radios (the infamous Baofengs), since FRS/GMRS radios just display the selected channel number, not the actual frequency. That kind of re-programming would allow a hand-held radio to operate in FRS/GMRS, in the middle of UHF TV allocations*, and generally around the UHF land mobile frequencies.

    I would not be surprised if some agency is running FCC license record searches on those under investigation, but it is unlikely that any of them bothered to get a GMRS license. A amateur license might be more likely.

    [* Back in the analog days, wireless microphones were often set for locally “unused” television frequencies – and the stations themselves would use frequencies in their station channel’s frequency range for internal radio telephony.]

    • Tom R. says:

      462.662 is an abbreviation for 462.6625. It’s intentional. It’s routine. It’s unambiguous. Operating on 462.6620 would be highly disadvantageous. The rounded-off frequency is sufficient to identify the channel, and once you know the channel you know the exact frequency plus a host of other details.

      • Raven Eye says:

        Clarification: It’s due to the radio’s display — which only shows three full-size numerals to the right of the decimal point. There is a “mini” numeral which can be added through a few keypad programming steps, but might escape notice. The programming software allows the full XXX,XXXX, plus a channel name.


    There is a missing command-and-control element for both Oath Keepers and Proud Boys. My suspicion has been that they operated jointly and that OK and PB had a joint task force-like setup at a nearby hotel. But, much more data is needed.

    Command-and-Control is very much dependent upon communications networks. In military intelligence, that is crucial. Who is talking to whom? Who is sending orders? Who is sending SALUTE SITREPs (situation reports on Size, Activity, Location, Unit, Time, Equipment). The live-streams are excellent SALUTE reports–you get audio and visual data.

    In terms of communications nets, Proud Boys apparently had four nets:
    Baofeng radio net
    Zello net
    Telegram New MOSD (leadership)
    Telegram Boots On The Ground (grunts)

    Oath Keepers have been linked to two networks:

    Zello (“Stop the Steal J6”)
    Facebook (Caldwell, not an Oath Keeper but with them), was sending SITREPs.

    Caldwell was also receiving directives via Facebook. For example, he was told that House members were “in the tunnels” and to “Turn on gas.” Then he received a directive to “Go through back house chamber doors facing N left down hallway down steps.”

    The latter message suggests the sender knows where Caldwell is, where Caldwell needs to go, and how Caldwell should get there.

    The January 13th Guardian article reported that the founder of mymilitia dot com stated that “intel” would be gathered on the Zello channel (DC 3.0) and verified intel would be sent on Telegram to “boots on the ground.” Now, “boots on the ground” could be just a common phrase and have no significance. Or, it could actually refer to the Proud Boys Telegram channel “Boots On The Ground.” If you were just overhearing the conversation, as the two journalists were, they might miss the capitalized version.

    Were Oath Keepers and other militia elements also on a Telegram channel shared with the Proud Boys? Or, did they have their own Telegram channel for passing confirmed intelligence to all their units?

    I say all their units because there is a North Carolina Oath Keeper unit that has not been discussed in government motions. If it has, I’ve missed it. But, Caldwell told Watkins that 40+ people from North Carolina were coming in “one full bus.”

    The superseding indictment for the 9 Oath Keepers, and previous motions, indicate that Watkins, the Ohio leader of Oath Keepers, is sending SITREPs to someone. She is getting directives from someone. Thus, she appears to be in a subordinate position to a command element.

    Oath Keepers may have had one or two command elements. That’s kind of bulky for a small operation. But, who is in command of the “heavy” armed Quick Reaction Force? That would probably not be Watkins. It might the command element she is communicating with. Or, it could be some higher level of command within the national Oath Keepers or a command tied solely to the QRF

    In the former case, that would be someone in the national Oath Keepers headquarters. The only person I know in Oath Keepers who has openly talked about Quick Reaction Forces at various Oath Keepers operations is Stewart Rhodes. In the latter case, someone would request the QRF deploy and it would be up to the QRF commander to decide whether to comply or not.

    But, what should be clear is that while Watkins was in charge of her Ohio unit and whoever got attached to it, there is at least one missing command-and-control element for Oath Keepers, and possibly two more (QRF and North Carolina unit).

    Then, there is the question of the communication linkage between Proud Boys and Oath Keepers.

    The Unindicted Co-Conspirator-1 who handles communications for Proud Boys knows who was on which nets. He would know if there were other communication nets that PB Leadership was connected to, particularly with Oath Keepers. Someone in Oath Keepers needs to cooperate in order to fill-in this communications picture. Or, the FBI needs to release more data.

    As the FBI releases more information about communications, the picture of command-and-control gets clearer, and points out where there may be holes in the picture.

    • subtropolis says:

      All good questions. But, a correction: Jessica Watkins and Donovan Crowl were with the “Ohio Regular State Militia” that had joined up under the OK leadership for the event. Watkins text to Crowl: “Looks like we might be security for Roger Stone, if we end up rolling with the Oathkeepers.” She was most certainly not the leader of OK in Ohio.

      Ditto on the quick reaction force. Watkins text to Bennie Parker: “We are not bringing firearms. QRF will be our law enforcement members of Oathkeepers.” I doubt that Watkins could even identify any of them.

      Oath Keeper Kelly Meggs: “You guys gonna carry? Ok, we aren’t either, we have a heavy QRF 10 min out though.”

      I believe that Thomas Caldwell might know something more about it, though. He’s the one who mentioned the QRF to Watkins in his “schlep the weps” commentary about it. I think both he and Stewart Rhodes are potentially big prizes.

      • JAMES SCAMINACI says:

        Yes, you are correct Watkins was the commander of the Ohio State Regular Militia and a member of Oath Keepers. I meant that she was the head of the Oath Keeper contingent from Ohio, not head of the Oath Keepers overall in Ohio.

        The definitive statement on QRFs comes from Rhodes (Person One) on the encrypted Signal app (see below).

        Here is Rhodes talking about the November protest in DC: “Oath Keepers will also have some of our most skilled special warfare veterans standing by armed, just outside D.C., as an emergency QRF in the event of a worst case scenario in D.C. (such as a “Benghazi” style assault on the White House by communist terrorists, in conjunction with stand-down orders by traitor generals).”

        After this, Rhodes goes publicly quiet on a QRF in DC, though he gets increasingly agitated as December slides into January.

        However, in the March 8th filing by the government in opposition to Caldwell’s release from detention, in an encrypted SIGNAL channel called “DC OP JAN 6 21,” Person One, which is Rhodes, tells Kelly Meggs, Jessica Watkins and “regional Oath Keeper leaders from multiple states around the country” that “‘We will have several well equipped QRFs outside DC.'”

        Rhodes then suggests that he has been informed or directly knows that “‘there are many, many others, from other groups, who will be watching and waiting on the outside in case of worst case scenarios.'”

        The government filing notes that Caldwell was not on this encrypted chat and I assume he is probably not cleared for this higher level Oath Keeper planning.

        Now, maybe Watkins and Caldwell coordinated with Oath Keepers in North Carolina to be part of their assault effort in terms of providing 40+ bodies, including a QRF.

        But, Caldwell and Crowl talk about a QRF during Jan 1-2. The Signal chat, which Caldwell was not privy to, happens on an undisclosed date and time, according to the government’s filing. Rhodes’ statement to several Oath Keepers leaders around the country is the definitive statement.

        Kelly Meggs is far more important than Caldwell. Meggs was “OK Gator 1” and Watkins had him in her phone as “FL Kelly Meggs–Oathkeepers.”

        According to the Second Superseding Indictment for the Oath Keepers, “Gator 1” and “Gator 6,” the latter being Kenneth Harrelson, were 2 of 3 “organizers” of the 18-participant “online meeting” on January 3rd. That meeting was called the “dc planning call.”

        Is that January 3rd online meeting the Signal “chat” with Rhodes and the Oath Keeper leaders from around the country? Apparetnly yes

        In the Second Superseding Indictment, para 46, Watkins is invited on Dec 31, 2020, to participate in a “‘leadership only'” conference call” for the “‘DC op'” on Signal.

        The government filings have bits and pieces that certainly suggest that the Oath Keepers, including Person One, engaged in far more operational planning, with contingency planning as well. There were more Oath Keepers leaders involved than just Jessica Watkins. There were more Oath Keeper “units” or “elements” than just the Ohio State Regular Militia members.

        The filing suggests that other unnamed groups had similar contingency forces outside DC.

        That suggests that there is more communication networks to discover. I mean suppose five groups had 1 each QRF for a contingency. Those groups might want to have all 5 QRFs react in near-real time in some coordinated manner. Or not, depending upon their level of sophistication and expertise in planning a military operation.

      • Lady4Real says:

        Wasn’t there a seditionist caught with a pickup truck full of guns and ammo? Maybe they were relying on him for their stash. He was parked within DC proper not 10 minutes from the capital, if I remember correctly.

        • posaune says:

          That was Lonnie (?) Coffman, the guy with the red truck parked illegally on 1st street SE near the Capitol South Metro entrance and in front of the Eisenhower RNC building. (Very close to where the hoodie person put the bomb). It was within 500 of the House Office Bldg and probably 1500 feet of the Capitol.

        • harpie says:

          Yes. Lonnie COFFMAN

          […] At approximately 6:30 p.m., a blue sedan with a female driver and a male front passenger, approached law enforcement officers in the 400 block of First Street, Southeast. Officers made contact with the vehicle, and the male passenger stated that he was trying to get to his vehicle that was parked in the 300 block of First Street, Southeast, which is the location that the Red GMC Sierra 1500 pickup truck had been located and searched. […]

          The man said his name was “Lonnie.” They had already searched and ID’d the Alabama truck.

          […] The man asked officers whether they had located the bombs, which officers initially understood to be a reference to the components to the destructive devices located in COFFMAN’s truck, but later understood to be a reference to the secure perimeter that had been set up by law enforcement, which perimeter had kept COFFMAN from returning to his car earlier. […]

          At this point, [1/7/21] the United States Capitol Police does not attribute the explosive devices at the National Republican Club and the Democratic National Committee Headquarters to COFFMAN. […]

  7. subtropolis says:

    Your suspicions about the Kelly brothers make sense to me. One hopes that prosecutors will likewise turn up witnesses — even if not PBs themselves— who’ll agree to cooperate against each one of the PBs. The more weight against them, the better the opportunities that some will turn on each other, putting the leaders in an ever-tightening spot, that they might begin to spill about who was running them, and paying the bills. (*cough* Stone *cough* Mercer)

    I’ve long suspected that the PBs and OKs might have been streaming so as to provide live coverage to their co-conspirators. It was this passage which all but convinced me:
    – – –
    He then turns the camera to the crowd behind him and says, “Keep ‘em coming. Keep ‘em coming.”
    – – –

    Of course, one could credibly argue that Garcia was doing the same thing that most other participants were: holding his mobile aloft to capture the events for posterity. (And fucking themselves in the process haha) To the complaint that the PBs would be unlikely to have concerned themselves with such bullshit in the midst of this action, one might argue that they hoped to use the video for later recruitment inspiration. But, all that is swept aside, imho, by his looking directly into the camera and saying, “Keep ‘em coming.” There’s not much ambiguity there.

    • PeterS says:

      On the bill paying thing, the detention memo for Worrell mentions payments for the vans and hotel rooms by “another individual”. That language perhaps suggests that the DOJ already knows who it was that paid (the girlfriend might have told them?).

      You can read the passage in the memo as meaning someone not on the trip paid, but I’m not sure there’s necessarily an implication that it wasn’t someone travelling with Worrell. It might mean no more than neither he nor his girlfriend paid.

      (Btw I’m not saying either you or ew said the payer was not on the trip.)

        • subtropolis says:

          How in the world could you have missed all of those qualifiers?! “perhaps suggests”, “can read … as meaning”, “I’m not sure there’s necessarily …”

          Oh, that’s right — it’s because you never fail to pass up an opportunity to shit on someone in the comments. Lighten up! We’re simply trying to work through this because we’re fucking curious. The day that Marcy demands an end to speculation here she may as well fold up shop.

        • PeterS says:

          Thanks, though I was looking forward to some argy-bargy with bmaz :-)

          I don’t want him to change.

          P.S. perhaps quite wrongly, I interpreted “individual” as excluding plural persons or an organisation, and thus implying some degree of knowledge. 

    • earthworm says:

      and in addition, all the other travel and accommodation expenses of insurrectionists from around the country?
      the many videos, live-streaming, and selfies look like receipts for reimbursement, as well as being tactical intel for ‘general jack d ripper’ or whoever it was the PB’s directives “from the top” came from.

      • timbo says:

        I’m kind of interested how the location of the pickup truck with the guns was picked. Is there any clarity on that as yet? Basically, it’s in the same local as the bomber… could be coincidence… Was there something about the GOP HQ that resulted in the truck being parked there or is that just coincidence?

  8. AndTheSlithyToves says:

    [Does someone know which side of the building this is?]
    I’m pretty sure it’s the Northwest side of the building (the Senate Side–not that these yahoos would have known that). When the camera pans around, you can see lots of construction cranes and at 33-34 seconds in, you can see the Old Post Office tower (currently Trump Hotel) to the far right of the frame behind the rioters.

    • Ginevra diBenci says:

      Those “yahoos” seem to have known a lot about the Capitol building, knowledge of the type that would aid them in operationalizing their goals. And knowledge it would behoove us to find out how they acquired.

      • PeterS says:

        A few weeks ago I googled “Capitol floor plan” and got no shortage of detailed images. I simply don’t know if there’s evidence of the insurrectionists having non-public information about the building.  

        • BobCon says:

          I can’t say across the board, but what’s missing from a lot of those maps is the ID for rooms. You’ll find some listings for major rooms, but most of them are just listed as H123 or S111 and there is nothing to indicate which one is Clyburn’s personal office or where Schumer’s top staff sits. The rooms themselves often aren’t labelled either.

  9. Ginevra diBenci says:

    How much of all this painstaking work (by Dr. EW and the folks here as well as DOJ, etc.) just got sabotaged by Michael Sherwin blabbing all over 60 Minutes? Prosecutorial misconduct would seem now to be an affirmative defense.

    • subtropolis says:

      How so? I have not seen the interview, but the only subject of note that I have seen is that he mentioned a strong possibility of sedition charges. Is that what you’re complaining about? If so, how is that sabotage or misconduct?

      • subtropolis says:

        Replying to my own comment to say that I’ve since come to understand more about the interview. I’d been under the impression that Sherwin had left the DoJ altogether. And the gravity of what he revealed has become more apparent. Judge Mehta certainly is not pleased.

        • bmaz says:

          Oh, it is absolutely that bad. Worse really if you know DOJ protocols on this type of activity in ongoing investigations. Simply outrageous.

    • TooLoose LeTruck says:

      That would be one for bmaz and/or one of the other resident legal minds to analyze after watching the interview…

      I saw it and was wondering about that, too…

      IANAL so my opinion doesn’t carry much heft and I’d like to think that the DOJ knew he was going on 60 Minutes, okayed his appearance, and maybe even gave him pre-approved talking points but again, my opinion is good for bubkis…

      And I have a hard time believing, on the face of it, that Sherwin would go on air unannounced and just go all over the place in the interview…

      • rosalind says:

        EW re-tweeted a CNN reporter who stated: “Michael Sherwin, the former acting US attorney for the District of Columbia, didn’t get prior approval from his Justice Department bosses before the 60 Minutes interview, according to people briefed on the matter, a break with protocol.”

        EW’s comment: “That’s epically fucked in the head.”

        • TooLoose LeTruck says:

          Oh my gawd…

          He DIDN’T get approval ahead of time?

          You’re got to be kidding me…

          (I know you’re not…)

          I damn near speechless… that’s almost beyond belief…

          Shouldn’t that cost the dingbat his job?

          What could he have possibly been thinking?

    • Eureka says:

      Well said, as was your comment on this topic on the prior page. The excerpts I saw of the interview (content and tenor — so … casual) were troubling enough that I feel I have to watch the whole thing yet don’t have the heart for marinating in said sabotage (intentional or otherwise).

      Sherwin had already raised the spectre of seditious conspiracy charges in his lone presser — at that point early and in general enough terms that it didn’t make for an accidental show of incompetence.

      [Cringing from the (post-) Mueller muscle memory]

      This investigation is too important. But of course —

      Bill Barr strikes again.

  10. Rugger9 says:

    OT, but apparently Sidney Powell filed an answer to the Dominion Voting Systems lawsuit. According to Buzzfeed (consider the source) she’s claiming that no reasonable person would believe the statements she made (i.e. about Hugo Chavez, etc., et al) and so she cannot be held liable for expressing 1A protected opinions.

    I think the claim is ridiculous on several levels, but I’m biased. IIRC she argued in court papers otherwise, not just in the press. Is the claim bogus and is this enough to get her disbarred?

  11. greenbird says:

    i came here for the challenges.
    i stayed here to learn diplomacy.
    commenters, i salute you. that includes bm.az.

  12. Eureka says:

    Front Door — Leadership Mashup!

    Alan Feuer: “New detail in a just unsealed detention letter in the case of Philly Proud Boy leader Zach Rehl. Prosecutors say Rehl got a real-time message from his co-conspirator Charles Donohoe that another Proud Boy (Dominic Pezzola) had just stolen a riot shield from cops. [screenshots, incl the photo of Rehl in Merkley’s office]”
    4:47 PM · Mar 22, 2021


    These are nested QTs:

    Alan Feuer: “Amazing. Today prosecutors said in a bail filing that Proud Boy Charles Donohoe told Proud Boy Zach Rehl that Proud Boy Dominic Pezzola had stolen a police riot shield. Then, hours later, the internet provides video of the incident.”
    8:15 PM · Mar 22, 2021

    Move Silent Sam: “@alanfeuer Here’s video of Charles Donohoe & Dominic Pezzola carrying the police riot shield, which is highlighted in the just unsealed detention letter in the case of Philadelphia “Proud Boys” leader Zach Rehl. Video also shows “Spazzo” breaking the Capitol window.”

    Move Silent Sam: “Proud Boys members Dominic Pezzola & Charles Donohoe carrying a riot shield together during the Capitol insurrection on 1/6. “Spazzo” used a shield to break a window and enter the building, as seen here. Pezzola was charged in January in NY. Donohoe was arrested on 3/17 in NC. [video]”
    2:18 AM · Mar 19, 2021

    Donohoe the eager beaver strikes again (in re evidentiary fodder). There are consequences to palling around with … pals.

    Rehl’s detention hearing is tomorrow (Tues 3/23).

  13. harpie says:

    9:06 AM · Mar 22, 2021

    The day after Trump unsuccessfully tried to stage a coup, John Ratcliffe made a change to intelligence collection priority setting. [link to Steven Aftergood tweet]

    Aftergood links to:
    A New Policy on Setting Intelligence Priorities https://fas.org/blogs/secrecy/2021/03/intelligence-priorities/
    Steven Aftergood March 22, 2021

    Shortly before the end of the Trump Administration in January 2021 [1/7/21], then-Director of National Intelligence John Ratcliffe issued a directive that altered the process for preparing the National Intelligence Priorities Framework, or NIPF, stripping out limitations on signals intelligence collection from the previous policy. […]

    The new revision, which was published on the ODNI website last week, includes several noteworthy changes to the 2015 policy.

    Most striking is the removal of all references to the Obama Presidential Policy Directive (PPD) 28 that was issued in the wake of the Snowden disclosures. PPD 28 included new limitations on signals intelligence collection and directed that whenever possible, “feasible alternatives to signals intelligence should be prioritized.” […]

      • Rugger9 says:

        Well, nothing in an official manner, but given the way DJT operates I would not be surprised if Michael Flynn’s input was channeled through his brother who was there in the WH despite the efforts to hide that fact.

        I had also wondered about Stone, who seems to have been emboldened by his pardon and probably understood the insurrection was his last chance to be himself in public. I don’t remember seeing much from him lately, and I think we will see linkages and perhaps a sighting on the 6th. The fact his Proud Boys were so involved is a pretty strong indication Stone was pulling some strings. That would be above and beyond setting this in motion with the “Stop the Steal” rallies.

        • BobCon says:

          I don’t think Stone was emboldened by the pardon so much as carrying out what was planned. I think the pardon/commuted sentence was meant to give him freedom to do this kind of thing.

          He could have been freed like Manafort right before Christmas, but that would have been too late. I think the plan since July had been activating the network, either with an eye toward disrupting the election or, giving the polling, disrupting the transfer of power.

          Given Trump’s haphazardness, I don’t know if he had committed to a coup attempt before the election — certainty of victory and his Covid case may have distracted him from fully engaging. But I think he was clear he needed Stone active and ready long before the election, and Stone may well have laid out for him how much time, money and cooperation he would need.

        • PeterS says:

          Probably not a popular view here, but I’ll push back on the Charles Flynn thing. I don’t like the “sins of the brother” approach. Of course it raises questions (with few answers) but I’m not aware that he was in the chain of command. What I do know is that his promotion had only recently been approved by voice vote in the Senate. I’d like a little more evidence before accusing the man.

  14. harpie says:

    “SOMETHING is up” wrt: OATH KEEPERS case

    9:19 AM · Mar 23, 2021

    Something is up in the Jan. 6 Oath Keepers conspiracy case: The judge [MEHTA] this morning set a hearing for this afternoon [4:30 PM] “concerning recent statements to the media about these proceedings” and is requiring all the lawyers (defense and govt) in the 10-person case to be on the line. [screenshot]

    • harpie says:

      As Marcy says on twitter:

      Looks like the judge in the Oath Keeper case was not amused by Sherwin’s 60 Minutes piece, justifiably so.

      I wonder how many lawyers that is.

      • Rugger9 says:

        What is Sherwin’s background? He’s a Trumpkin appointed in 2020 to the DC office by AG Barr after serving with Rosen on NatSec matters (he’s a former USN intel officer). He also helped Barr in his mandamus fiasco for Flynn, so he’s a “true believer”. That might explain why the interview was done, in order to torpedo the prosecution but one of the lawyers might have that information at hand. Let’s remember how politicized DJT and AG Barr made DOJ and Biden wouldn’t have had time to move all of them out.

        Unforced errors like this kind (which were very Barr-ish in its insinuations) did not have to occur, but IIRC the remedy is a change of venue. After all, I don’t think Sherwin named names about who would have been subject to the sedition charge but it’s also not a long list of options on that menu either. It’s probably a distinction without a difference.

        • J R in WV says:

          When you say “Unforced errors like this kind (which were very Barr-ish in its insinuations) did not have to occur, but IIRC the remedy is a change of venue.” do you mean a change of venue to a location where 60 Minutes is not broadcast on Sunday evening? ‘Cause that would be outside the USA…

          I think the fact that this guy [ Sherwin ] was appointed by The Former Guy and his DOJ probably means this won’t demolish the court case.

      • PeterS says:

        I recognise that the 60 Minutes appearance was ill-judged, but I need some help understanding how it affects the legal situation.

        At the January press conference Sherwin said the following (apologies for the caps):


        • bmaz says:

          If you can’t figure out how such comments inflame and prejudice the investigation and ongoing court cases, I am not sure I can help you.

        • bmaz says:

          FFS, YOU imposed the ridiculous question of “I recognise that the 60 Minutes appearance was ill-judged, but I need some help understanding how it affects the legal situation.”

          That question was loaded with a lot more than “about the judge setting a hearing today.” The immediate response by the court says a lot. It inflames and prejudices the greater investigation and ongoing charged cases, that’s how.

        • PeterS says:

          And I “recognised” the appearance was “ill-judged”. End of argy-bargy, from me anyway.

        • P J Evans says:

          Lawyers aren’t supposed to talk about cases that are in the courts. Period. Neither are judges or jurors. It’s prejudicial.

    • Silly but True says:

      Most were not released but some were, notably Caldwell. But there doesn’t seem to be reports of defendants going on, say, problematic 60 minutes interviews or things like that which would raise ire of judge.

      But prosecution’s side?

      • harpie says:


        Judge Ahmet Mehta is not amused with the 60 Minutes antics of Michael Sherwin. Nor should he be, it was completely absurd. Mehta is appropriately blistering the prosecution. Will consider sanctions and a gag order.

        Mehta is blistering DOJ’s ass.

        Lol, DOJ is, and properly so, hanging Sherwin out to dry. Apparently referring him to OPR, which is absolutely feckless as to this.

        And the multiple defense attys are saying they were all contacted and did not think about selling out the case like Sherwin did. Brutal. Now a female defense lawyer even apologizing for making the most anodyne of media responses, and Mehta properly notes that was not a problem.

        And scene!

  15. harpie says:

    Congress Helped Their Businesses During the Pandemic. Then They Attacked the Capitol.
    Some of the most high-profile insurrectionists—facing the most serious charges—are people who received government loans during the pandemic.
    Matt Fuller Updated Mar. 23, 2021 9:33AM

    […] Collectively, these business owners took in more than $227,000 from three small business relief initiatives—the Paycheck Protection Program, Economic Injury Disaster Loans, or Disaster Assistance Loans—and they are facing charges ranging from entering a restricted building to assaulting police officers with a deadly weapon. […]

    Brandon STRAKA, Dominic PEZZOLA, Julian KHATER, Scott FAIRLAMB, Paul WESTOVER,
    Richard “Bigo” BARNETT, Roberto MINUTA, Troy FAULKNER, Edward HEMENWAY

    • harpie says:

      This really got to me today…
      was going to write a little blurb about each one of these
      but one will do, and it’s STRAKA because he was first in the article.

      A tweet from STRAKA on 1/6

      Also- be embarrassed & hide if you need to- but I was there. It was not Antifa at the Capitol. It was freedom loving Patriots who were DESPERATE to fight for the final hope of our Republic because literally nobody cares about them. Everyone else can denounce them. I will not.

      • P J Evans says:

        *Gullible* “freedom-loving patriots” – they were trying to overthrow the election results, because they believed the lies that they were told, and couldn’t believe the real results.

        • harpie says:

          I don’t know…it seems to me MAGA World is throwing a huge tantrum because they didn’t get what they BELIEVE they were entitled to.

        • PeterS says:

          My one contact in that world was utterly convinced in October that Trump would win, and win easily.

        • skua says:

          GW’s invasion of Iraq, with the consequent ISIS breakout, had just as flimsy a justification. Death toll to date +2,000,000. These insurrectionists are following the example and lead of multiple POTUSs. Many were trained in killing and given combat experience due to GW’s poor choices.

        • PeterS says:

          I guess mass delusion has always been a big part of history, and often a fairly decisive part. The deluded always believe they are being rational. One might have hoped that mass delusion would be a less powerful force in the 21st century, especially one so clearly fake and promoted by somebody who knew it was all a lie. I pray (to?) that there will also be some accountability for that person and his enablers. 

  16. Silly but True says:

    It’s been almost nearly automatic that Judges have been issuing waivers to Speedy Trial Act requirements as part of COVID response, but we are already past point where the “trespassing” defendants have begun grumbling the US has already taken too long on something that is misdemeanor, will have no jail time and under normal circumstances would have already yielded guilty plea. That’s likely to see more of the majority of 400 who just have misdemeanor trespassing alone, join them, and they might find if theirs drag on much longer an agreeable judge who might start dismissing cases over tardiness fault.

  17. Zinsky says:

    Trump is too stupid and shallow to provide any meaningful command and control input. Where is Roger Stone in the heat of the fray? That vile scumbag has been involved in much of the Republican treachery of the past 50 years. It wouldn’t surprise me if this slime had a major hand in directing these clueless losers. Roger Stone should be in prison.

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